New DCU Earth2 is so gay. . .

[Mr. Hakujin]

 

New DCU Earth2 Alan Scott gives fisting a whole new meaning.

 

MTV Geek: First and foremost, what led to the decision to make this new iteration of Alan Scott gay?

 

James Robinson: It was just me trying to come up with a well balanced, diverse team. The only thing that bothered me about rebooting the character and making him younger again was that we lost his son Obsidian, who was gay - the original version, obviously, when he was an older man, with a son. And then with that in mind, I thought, well why not make Alan Scott gay - why not make the leader of the Justice Society gay? It worked on every level. I suggested it to Dan Didio, and to be fair to Dan, there wasn’t a moments hesitation. He said, “Yeah, great, great idea.”

 

Geek: I don’t think it’s something you’ve shied away from before, but why is sexuality even important to a comic book character?

 

JR: It isn’t that important to a comic book character, honestly, except that if you want comic books to be realistic, you have to acknowledge the diversity of the human race. And for there to be a team - just by the sheer percentage of people who are gay in the world - for there to be a team without a member who is gay just isn’t realistic. And then quite honestly, the more I thought about it, we had Alan Scott, people might be worried they lost this character...

I’m really taking it back to who he was originally. He was always this dynamic, brave, gallant guy that would die for everybody, he protected everybody, he had this knight’s good heart. He was always a media giant, he owned a radio station, and a TV station... Now it’s more the internet and the global media, but it’s really the same thing. He’s still this admirable, cool guy - Alan Scott’s my favorite Golden Age hero. I’ve always loved him, I loved him in ‘The Golden Age,’ I loved him in the time I got to write him in the Justice League. The only change is that he has a different sexuality, but that’s only a small aspect of who he is. Everything else is the same, it’s familiar, the same heroic guy who we’ve always known.

 

Geek: Comics haven’t had the best track record with handling homosexual characters. It often breaks down to that’s their one defining characteristic - every time they show up, they are the “gay character.” I imagine, based on what you’ve been saying, that’s not how you’re going to approach Alan Scott... But I am curious to hear how you plan on approaching him in Earth 2.

 

JR: He’s going to be the leader of the team, he’s going to be everything I just listed... And when we get to his private life, and focus on romance, it will be with a man. In the way that you would have a character, when it would feel right to have romance for the story, in their private life... That will be the only difference. Apart from that, the character is the same character.

I didn’t want to make this all about him being gay, gay, gay. Like you said, when it becomes too much like that... I have lots of gay friends, and they’re completely rounded people, of which their sexuality is only a part of who they are. I really want Alan Scott to be the same sort of character, like my real life friends.

 

Geek: This is an “only in comics” question, do the people on Earth 2 have different policies or questions towards homosexual relationships than we do in the United States?

JR: If I made it more liberal, it would strike as too unrealistic. One of the unfortunate things about the United States is that some states are less willing to people have their personal freedoms. So in Earth 2, some of those things are obstacles a gay person might face. But Alan Scott is a force of nature, so he would never let that stand in his way. He’s proud of who he is on every level.

 

Geek: Are we going to see Alan in a relationship at all? And if so, will it be someone we know, or someone new?

 

JR: I’m still working that out... But it will probably be somebody new. Just for now, I’m trying to establish his origin, who Alan Scott is, in terms of all aspects of who he is. So for the first few issues, there are plenty of aspects I’m focusing on apart from his sexuality.

 

Geek: To talk a little more broadly, I know you can’t really comment on what other publishers or writers are doing, but clearly there’s some sort of critical mass that’s hit the past two weeks in terms of discussing gay characters in comics. Why do you think now is the right time?

 

JR: I don’t know that this is the right time. Sometimes things just are in the air, things just happen because they happen. I was planning this for eight months. And quite honestly, I don’t think myself, or DC, or Dan thought it was going to get this much attention. Northstar has been around for twenty-five years. And Archie, having their first gay character relatively recently. Things just happen because it’s the right time to happen. I’m just glad the time is now, I guess.

I call some major league BS on that bit I underlined--of course they did it for publicity! Well, maybe technically it can be true. I'm sure by "this much attention" he could also mean "this little attention."

 

Stunts aside, I think it could be interesting. Too bad the writing on Earth2 seems terrible. Click the spoiler tag for the actual "gay" pages from the issue.

 

 

 

 

 

As far as I know this is the first gay DC character. Marvel only has Shatterstar & Rictor (Bisexual?), and now Northstar as gay characters, right?

[Maldron]

I enjoyed the first issue of Earth 2 well enough. Just find it weird they're making a reboot in the middle of their reboot.

[Ganny McVagflaps]

I always knew D.C. folk were butt bandits.

[Thelogan]

'Baytor, can you give me a scumbag slowpoke up in here?

 

Northstar has been gay for liiiike 14 years.

Off the top of my head, there's also those two guys in the young avengers. Mini-Hulk and Oogly-boogly or something.

 

And Mystique, Destiny, Karma, Phat & the werewolf dude in X-Statix and...uh, Rawhide Kid, I guess.

[Visitant]

 

Grats DC, you're doing breaking new ground.

 

...no wait, you're not.

 

there are plenty of aspects I’m focusing on apart from his sexuality.

 

This is the only line that I really cared about. Sexual preference can be a part of a character but don't center the whole character around that one aspect. I guess until we can just accept that people have same sex relationships this is going to be a thing for a while (ooh gay characters on TV!!!) but I for one am fucking over it.

 

TL:DR - If a character is gay, don't write them any differently because they are gay.

Edited June 2, 2012 by Bindusara

[Thelogan]

TL:DR - If a character is gay, don't write them any differently because they are gay.

 

Agreed, it should be as much importance as any other character's sexuality, which is usually just incidental.

Unfortunately, it's pretty much never like that. I think Richter was handled with a bit of class (disclaimer: I'm not much further in X-Factor than the reveal), but then you have shit like Rawhide Kid, which was just offensive.

[Mr. Hakujin]

Ah, Mystique! But she's more bisexual or since she can really shift into either gender. She could very well be her own category. But Destiny is totes lez. What about the chick that used to run the Morlocks, the one w/ the eypatch--was she gay or am I just stereotyping based on her look? And isn't Karma an alien? Not that it matter since we're talking about gay superheroes in general, aliens or otherwise.

 

TL:DR - If a character is gay, don't write them any differently because they are gay.

But if you're being honest to the character you kind of would have to write them differently--at least to a degree--than a hetero hero. The homosexuality itself would be a difference that'd have to be addressed. Think of all the hoopla that occurs when a pro-sports player comes out as gay. And that's even really only after they've retired. Imagine the shit storm that would occur if a current pro-MVP cam out. the Wouldn't that be magnified tenfold in a world w/ superheroes?

 

That decision for the hero to come out or remain closeted, the drama, the pathos surrounding it, wouldn't that make for a great story or stories? So, in that sense, yes, one would have to write the character differently b/c they're gay. And if done correctly it could be a very good thing.

 

Just sayin'.

[Thelogan]

Nah, Callisto is straight. She's just a tomboy. Maybe she had to alpha it up a bit to lead those sewer freaks?

She kidnapped Angel once because she deserved a beautiful husband.

 

That decision for the hero to come out or remain closeted, the drama, the pathos surrounding it, wouldn't that make for a great story or stories?

 

Probably not, no. Sounds pretty cliche from here.

I liked the bit in Morrison's New X-Men run where Xavier wanted Northstar to teach because he represented a minority within a minority, and the gay students could probably use some kind of role model (y'know...besides Jumbo Carnation).

Even that started jumping the shark with the "crush on Iceman" bit.

[Thelogan]

[Keth]

New meme? Gay Gardner.

 

 

[Thelogan]

Waitaminute, Batwoman has been gay for years and no one really gives a shit. Myself included, because I'd practically forgotten.

It's weird that it's such a big deal when it's a dude.

[Visitant]

Yeah? That's was kinda my point when i used the tiny font. I guess I should have been a bit clearer. She's a prime example of being written well though. A bunch of the stuff I've read of her didn't throw in your face that she was gay, her relationships were a natural part of her character not "OH LESBIAN"!

 

Unlike some people...I'm looking at you Gen 13.

[Maldron]

To be fair, Binds, there are quite a few "I'M GAY" homosexuals out there. I don't mean anything like obvious-at-a-glance, but tells-you-every-time.

Edited June 2, 2012 by Maldron

[Visitant]

And I think they are part of the problem, not at all the solution. Because people throw titles like "I'M GAY" in your face people become more prone to act out against it. I know a lot of people who say "I don't care if you're gay, just don't be all in my face about it" and they mean it. They don't care who marries who, as long as they are happy. It's how I feel. It doesn't need to be a THING, just live your life and be happy. If you need to announce it to me you're just begging for attention.

[Panch]

I fucking love Young Avengers. Wiccan and Hulkling are gay AND teens. The writers don't make a big deal about it. That's how it should be.

[Thelogan]

I just caught this.

 

And isn't Karma an alien?

 

That's a pretty fucked up way to think of the Vietnamese.

 

I tried to figure out who you might be thinking of, but I've got nothin'.

[Mr. Hakujin]

Nah, Callisto is straight. She's just a tomboy. Maybe she had to alpha it up a bit to lead those sewer freaks?

She kidnapped Angel once because she deserved a beautiful husband.

Callisto! That's her name! OK. Callisto not gay. Batwoman gay. Got it. Is anyone reading what's been going on w/ her in the New DCU? I haven't read any issues yet, but the art looks good, very Vertigo-ish.

 

I just caught this.

 

 

 

That's a pretty fucked up way to think of the Vietnamese.

 

I tried to figure out who you might be thinking of, but I've got nothin'.

Karma isn't the alien chick from The Runaways? Wasn't she gay?

Edited June 3, 2012 by Mr. Hakujin

[Thelogan]

Ohhhhh, Karolina. Yeah, she's gay too. Forgot about that.

 

I was referring to the asian mind controller from The New Mutants.

[Panch]

Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds.

[Ganny McVagflaps]

[The NZA]

DC Comics forbids Batwoman's gay marriage, creative team leaves

 

J.H. Williams III and W. Haden Blackman have announced they'll be leaving as the editorial team on Batwoman, citing DC's editorial interference and in particular, the publisher's refusal to allow characters Kate Kane/Batwoman and her partner Gotham City police officer Maggie Sawyer marry each other.

 

That's right, while Batwoman has proposed to Maggie twice — twice on panel — DC not only refused to let the wedding be depicted on panel, but refused to let them be married at all. "[We] were told emphatically no marriage can result," said Williams on Twitter. He later added it was "was never put to us as being anti-gay marriage." Although how refusing to let people marry — even fictional characters — is not anti-gay marriage is beyond me.

 

Williams and Blackman will leave the series after issue #26 in December; given that Batwoman is one of DC's best titles — and arguably its best-looking comic period, thanks to Williams' incredible art and panel experimentation — it's a loss readers will feel keenly, even if DC doesn't.

 

On the other hand, maybe it doesn't matter if the creative team left, given the hassles DC was giving them. Here's a list from Williams' and Blackman's official statement, detailing the editorial interference:

Unfortunately, in recent months, DC has asked us to alter or completely discard many long-standing storylines in ways that we feel compromise the character and the series. We were told to ditch plans for Killer Croc’s origins; forced to drastically alter the original ending of our current arc, which would have defined Batwoman’s heroic future in bold new ways; and, most crushingly, prohibited from ever showing Kate and Maggie actually getting married. All of these editorial decisions came at the last minute, and always after a year or more of planning and plotting on our end.

 

We’ve always understood that, as much as we love the character, Batwoman ultimately belongs to DC. However, the eleventh-hour nature of these changes left us frustrated and angry — because they prevent us from telling the best stories we can. So, after a lot of soul-searching, we’ve decided to leave the book after Issue 26.

Williams and Blackman say they're "heartbroken" to leave the title, and as a big Batwoman fan, I am too. Back in February, I posited that DC's refusal to publicize Kate's proposal to Maggie was an attempt to not give the press another reason to talk about noted homophobe Orson Scott Card's upcoming run on Adventures of Superman. I don't know if DC felt it worked, but given how happy DC was to promote Alan Scott's newfound homosexuality in the New 52 last year, I certainly found the lack of publicity significant.

 

In the first draft of this article, I though DC was only refusing to allow the wedding to take place on panel, partially because I couldn't comprehend DC would not allow the character to get married. But as Williams' tweet above shows, I was wrong. This is completely insane, and it goes well beyond DC's refusal to publicize an in-universe, homosexual character's proposal to her partner.

 

Leaving aside why DC would piss off one of their best creative teams, I can't fathom why DC would think this was a good idea, or at least not realize what a horrendously bad idea it is. Perhaps they thought that by never bringing it up they could keep the controversial Card hire from getting back into the spotlight, but surely someone at the company realized that allowing the marriage to take place would be a lot less controversial than refusing to let the marriage take place. Did they really not think it would come out? Who are they trying to please with this decision, other than Orson Scott Card and his ilk? Are they really worried about Card's feelings more than the majority of their readership?

 

Originally, I asked if DC realized ignoring the problem isn't actually a solution, but instead another part of the problem. Let me amend that: DC clearly has a problem here. And the fact that they don't seem to even realize it has a problem is possibly the biggest problem of all.

 

Bleeding Cool: JH Williams III Walks Off Batwoman Over DC Not Allowing Her Marriage To Maggie Sawyer (UPDATE)

 

JH Williams has further clarified;

 

@andykhouri Not wanting to be inflammatory, only factual- We fought to get them engaged, but were told emphatically no marriage can result.

 

— J.H. Williams III (@JHWilliamsIII) September 5, 2013

 

@andykhouri But must clarify- was never put to us as being anti-gay marriage.

 

— J.H. Williams III (@JHWilliamsIII) September 5, 2013

 

And DC has also stated:

 

As acknowledged by the creators involved, the editorial differences with the writers of BATWOMAN (pt 1)

 

— DC Comics (@DCComics) September 5, 2013

 

had nothing to do with the character’s sexual orientation. (pt 2)

 

— DC Comics (@DCComics) September 5, 2013

 

says DC:

 

UPDATE 11:53 AM, PDT: A DC Comics spokesperson has contacted CBR News, saying, "As acknowledged by the creators involved, the editorial differences with the writers of 'Batwoman' had nothing to do with the sexual orientation of the character."

 

 

 

(obligatory)

 

[Visitant]

woo...we gonna rant some on sundays show.

[Reverend Jax]

Congratulations, DC. Archie Comics is more with the times than you are.

 

Edited September 6, 2013 by Reverend Jax

[Iambaytor]

Gail Simone drew the truth out of them, apparently the reason DC didn't want them married is because they want no-one in the DCU married. Only Animal Man gets to be special.

[Keth]

And Animal Man has the worst wife ever