Silent Bob Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 Hm, maybe. But if that is the case, I'm still hoping Finding Nemo beats it next week. Reloaded was good, but Pixar deserves the hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 What do you mean, everyone of Pixar's films have grossed tons of money. "They deserve a hit" what you say about someone who's put out good stuff but hasn't had a hit (like ViewAskew, none of their five films has grossed more than $30 million). I agree that Finding Nemo should make lots of money, but it's not liek it's something that's been a long time coming, they've had nothign but hits. Tank Sues The Matrix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigChiefSlapaho Posted May 21, 2003 Author Share Posted May 21, 2003 Ultimate Matrix Screensaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signal08 Posted May 22, 2003 Share Posted May 22, 2003 Jax, I think he meant moreso...they deserve to be #1 box office. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Bob Posted May 22, 2003 Share Posted May 22, 2003 Right, I meant that, unlike most movies that make money (Daddy Day Care was second at the box office last week) Pixar films actually deserve the hits they get. Now, as for the Matrix...uh...well to tell ya the truth, I didn't think it was as good as the first one. Unfortunately I can only look at it as one movie, and not the first part of the two-part movie it actually is. So come November I might actually like this movie more. But as it stands I wasn't overly impressed with this one. First of all, the fight scenes. There's no question that the fight scenes are visually...well...astounding. If you like to watch fights there is no movie better than this one. But most of them seemed too aware of how visually impressive they were. They lasted forever! I mean there's only so many times I can watch Neo kick the crap out of someone before I get bored. I get that he's good, ok? Besides, how is it that the One has to take so long to dispatch or even just get away from his enemies? In the first movie, as soon as Neo became aware of his...for lack of a better word..."One-ness" he was able to take out Agent Smith in about 5 seconds flat. Why is it that now it takes him ten minutes (particularly in the fight with the Smiths, and the chateau fight)? The only logical reason is because the budget is bigger and they can afford to make the fights longer, because I can't see any other reason for it. These incredibly long fights really took away from some of the story that I think could have been fleshed out a bit more. Characters seemed to get from one place and one conclusion to another very quickly, often leaving many of the people in the audience trying to catch up - too busy wondering how and why they decided to go there, than what was going on, on the screen (the meeting with the Merovingian, and the final "plan" suffered the most from this, I thought). In the first Matrix they took the time to explain everything, in this one they hope the audience will just trust that the characters know what they're doing. The only part where the movie takes time to explain itself is the one remarkable sequence with what I like to call "Colonel Sanders" at the end, but most in the audience barely know how we even got to that point. Another part that needed some fleshing out was the subplot of the machines digging to Zion (it is really the main plot, but they discuss it so little it might as well be just a subplot). There is never really any urgency. In fact, I only recall one shot in the entire movie that even shows the machines digging there, the rest we just hear about through conversation, and even then it doesn't seem like that big a deal. From the two trailers I've seen for Revolutions, though, there seem to be a lot more "real world" machine action, so hopefully that will deal with the danger in a more...well...real way. But of course, the action scenes were incredible, the effects are the best you've seen so far, and the direction is gorgeous. I'm not saying this is a bad movie in any sense of the word - it's actually quite thrilling and impressive. I just expected a little more. I'm hoping when Revolutions comes out it will tie up all the loose ends and answer all the questions that Reloaded barely attempted to touch. IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JunkerSeed Posted May 22, 2003 Share Posted May 22, 2003 I pretty much agree with all you said bob, though I didn't mind the long fights at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Neo took out Agent Smith in like 5 second int he first one, but keep in mind he was fighting over a hundred Agent Smiths. If that scene didn't convey a sense of overwhelmingness to you, then there would be something wrong with you. And I think that is was a bit hard to follow, but so was Fight Club, 12 Monkeys, Pi and any good makes-you-think type movie the first time you watch them. Once you watch it a few times, I'm sure the story makes sense and it moves along at a good pace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Bob Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 (edited) I understood that the Smiths fight was meant to be overwhelming. I understood that when Neo was fighting a dozen Smiths. I understood it even more when he was fighting 25 Smiths. But by the time he was fighting 100 Smiths, I had gotten the point and I was more than ready for them to just get on with the story. The main problem I had with all of Reloaded's fight scenes (with the exception of the chase scene, because that didn't really have this problem) was that they didn't really connect with the story. They had no reason to be there. Every fight in the original Matrix movie had a reason, it served the plot. Trinity's fight at the beginning, the training sequence with Morpheus, the subway fight, all of them were intregal to the plot. But in Reloaded? There was no reason for Neo to fight the Agents at the beginning. There was no reason for him to fight the Smiths when he did - he could have just flown away when they started to overwhelm him. There was no reason for the Merovingian to have 6 lackeys to send after Neo just so Neo could fight them too (you'd think the Twins would be enough in the henchmen category for him). None of it served the plot, it only halted the plot for a good ten minutes of choreographed butt-kicking. And what about Seraph, the Oracle's "guardian"? So far he doesn't even have a reason to be in the movie except to have an excuse for another fight scene! And there are characters that weave in and out of this movie, people who are important to the plot, but the movie never takes time to flesh them out. Do we know anything about Niobe? Or Ghost? Or Soren? Or Bane? What about Cain and Able? No, the only way to find out their backstory, and get a feel for those characters is to go out and beat the video game (which I fortunately did before I saw the movie)! But most people haven't done that, so how can the average audience member have any clue who these people are and what their role in the plot is? I just think if less time had been spent choreographing the martial arts and rendering the special effects, they could have polished the story elements a little more and made a better movie. Edited May 23, 2003 by Silent Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Uh, Neo had to fight those 6 henchmen so that it would split Neo up from the other three (Morpheus, Trinity and the Keymaker). If they had stuck together, the chase scene wouldn't have been desperate, adn Neo couldn't come at the last minute to save them. The Smiths are evidently crucial to the third movie, so we'll see how the fight seems after the third movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signal08 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 they could have just done both...make the movie super long so you can have long fights and longer plot telling...I am sure anyone with no bladder problems would have sat in their seats for another 20 or 30 more minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JunkerSeed Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 I need to see this movie again, away from the huge fan crowd to take it in a little better. And not necesarrily because the plot will be clearer, just because I get a distorted view of a movie when I see it with an enormous adoreing crowd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deacon Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 I say it today and I wasnt very impressed. The fight scenes were good but the characters just seemed really boring. I've never liked Neo and the fact he is so invincible is just off putting. It was good to see Morpheous fight but every time a fight was over i found myself falling asleep. Just curious I know the Wachowski bro's did the story but did they write the script too. If they did, i think they would have been better off getting a decent script writer in for the dialogues cause they were poor at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigChiefSlapaho Posted May 25, 2003 Author Share Posted May 25, 2003 I'm with SB on that one. Didn't Neo seem a bit powered down for this movie? How come he never did any blurring fist moves / insane dodging? Why didn't he make any other agents explode? Was that a one-time deal in part 1? On the other hand, like deacon says, seeing him be all powerful gets a little boring. If he can beat anyone he wants without effort at all, then yeah the movie would've been tremendously gay. I see the point of making Neo have to concentrate more & still take hits, but then I have to say that they mislead us with the first Matrix in his abilities... shit, he beat Smith 1 handed after getting shot 8 times. It was cool to see him stop all the bullets from the mac10's, tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted May 25, 2003 Share Posted May 25, 2003 I think the reason his punches blurred in the first one was because the camera was filming in real time. The time slowed down to slow motion to show Neo unblurred. So while that fight against the Smith may have seemed like 10 minutes, maybe it was like 90 seconds? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted May 26, 2003 Share Posted May 26, 2003 Hah..i retract nothing, twas fun, the series is goin places, but Junker might have somethin with the plot: it was put on hold an awful lot. Then again, just as in X2, i dont mind if the plot goes bye bye for a while, as long as the actions cool and/or the characters evolve, and at least i got most of that. But yeah, i too should see it in a smaller crowd...i doubt Imax'll be like that but this was fun as fuck, and im not entirely sure what some of the critics were lookin for from this one..."too many fights!"? Its largely a sci-fi action movie, cmon, have you ever seen anythin Wu Ping cheoreographs? Youre lucky to get any plot, and i gotta say, if i was a director and had access to that guy, id be tempted to make a big 2 hour fight. The philosophical bits that were in there may not have been as smooth as part 1, granted, but again, the conversation with Neo & the counselor about machines, the meeting with the architect (god that was fun if you dig philosophy), the idea/presentation of "you know whats happening, but you dont know why", all well done, i left a very happy man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted May 26, 2003 Share Posted May 26, 2003 Again, I'm sure this is a much better 5 hour movie than it is two 2 hour 30 minute movies. It's been said byt the Washoski Bros that this one puts the plot on hold for action,a dn the third one will put the action on hold for plot. Makes sense, as that's how lots of stories should work, start of witht he dazzle, end witht he depth, plus it makes sense, action of summer, story for oscar season. I'm not saying it will get nominated, but Hollywood has conditioned people prefer deeper movie in the last two months of the year, it's like a hormonal cycle, except based on the solar year instead of the lunar month. Where was I? Oh yeah, I'm not retracting anything either, but I'm willing to bet the third one will make the naysayers look at the second one in a different light, like it was the necesary set up for something grand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unidentified Source Posted May 26, 2003 Share Posted May 26, 2003 Sounds similar to the LOTR pattern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spongebob Posted May 26, 2003 Share Posted May 26, 2003 Well.... i went and saw Matrix realoaded, Bruce Almighty, and X2 on the same day (paid for one) and Matrix came in seccond to X2 and Bruce Almighty last... But they are not really a good comparsion since Bruce is comedy and others are action Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Bob Posted May 27, 2003 Share Posted May 27, 2003 Yeah, that...really didn't give us any sort of information at all, Spongey, thanks. But I'll agree, I enjoyed X2 more than Reloaded. I'll probably go see Reloaded again but I'll probably just watch, and not even listen. Maybe find somethin' else to concentrate on, I dunno. I hope what Jax says about the plot being tighter in Revolutions. We'll see. Either way, I'll probably just go see Revolutions for the eye candy, too. Except for that one revelation of the world really being a computer program (one of the biggest movie revelations in history, I'll admit) I didn't really find the Matrix that impressive plot-wise. I'm a Dark City fan, myself. But we'll see how it turns out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Bob Posted May 29, 2003 Share Posted May 29, 2003 Y'know, I forgot to brag a bit and say I was right - Bruce Almighty did knock Reloaded from the number one spot last weekend. And tomorrow has The Italian Job and Finding Nemo, two movies that could easily take first and second, knocking Reloaded down to...fourth. And next week? 2 Fast 2 Furious - a movie that looks like crap, but judging from movie-goers' usual taste will also take the top spot. And I'm sure Dumb and Dumberer, Hollywood Homicide, or even Rugrats Go Wild will make the top three the week after that. So what does that mean? It means that Reloaded will be well out of the top five within a month of its release. Considering how long people have been waiting for it, and how big an event it is supposed to be, I find that remarkable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted May 30, 2003 Share Posted May 30, 2003 Well, as the weekend closed it broke $200 million and has passed X2. With 2 weekends and 1 work week it passed X2 that had 4 weekends and 3 work weeks under it's belt. Impressivo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbie Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 (edited) Well, I just got around too seeing Reloaded. Being out here in the wilderness, it took me a while. I liked it. My favorite scene was in the restaurant. Cowboy will curse at me for this but yeah, Even though I avoided reading news and gossip about the movie (Including this thread) I still figured out the ending of the movie about halfway through (Well not ALL of it but the One being a control method). Hell, I've been screaming that the Oracle was a computer program since the first movie came out... THe fights did go on too long and were often for no reason. I think Silent Bob dealt with that quite well. But as for the fights themse;ves: awesome. I haven't seen moves like that since the last time I beat Spiffytee into submission with my wang. (It's not as perverted as it sounds). I think the best measure of if a movie is enjoyable is if you go see it again and I did see it twice last weekend. Edited July 9, 2003 by Jumbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbie Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Oh yeah, one more thing: I don't care how skille dyou are, no one makes U-turns on a highway like that with a trailer or a bike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Bob Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Hell, I've been screaming that the Oracle was a computer program since the first movie came out... Yeah, I had that theory after the first one came out, too. Didn't seem like such mystical "prophecies" fit into a story that was so technology based. Actually after the first one I theorized that Neo himself might be a robot (Tank himself even referred to him as "a machine" at one point). His strange powers didn't seem to be able to exist in the world the machines created. But of course Reloaded threw that theory out the window (for now) because it showed another way that Neo could have really been a pawn of the machines. Now, I'm starting to wonder if everything in the movies is in a computer program. Perhaps what they think is reality is actually just another level of the Matrix. Everyone in this movie kept talking about various "levels" of reality, not to mention Neo's sudden ability to...use the Force (for lack of a better word) outside of the Matrix at the end. Hmmm. Must see again before I can decide more... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbie Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 I'm surprised that no one has a theory for the Neo survivor double that is in the last second of the movie... When it comes to doubles there are only four basic explanations: 1Clone, 2. Twin, 3. Future self, 4, Alternate Dimension/Timeline self. But With the matrix set up the way it is, they might have other explanation. I lost a lot of respect for the first movie cuz it had plot holes (which Reloaded actually explained) such as how Zion was created by hapless refugees. I'm still not clear why dying in the matrix should affect the real world body and I definitely don't get why the real world body takes damage. I suppose Revolutions will have the explanations for the Neo double. And his Force powers, of course... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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