Silent Bob Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 Not saying you're not justified, just that Gilliam has a lot of endings like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbie Posted November 5, 2006 Author Share Posted November 5, 2006 He makes movies that are upbeat and optimistic for 90% and then pulls the rug out from under you with an ending where fate/omnipotent forces beyond your control/Evil stomps all over your piddling ambitions to self-determination and happiness? He must have had a bleak childhood or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Bob Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 Mm, yeah, pretty much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 He makes movies that are upbeat and optimistic for 90% and then pulls the rug out from under you with an ending where fate/omnipotent forces beyond your control/Evil stomps all over your piddling ambitions to self-determination and happiness? Well, 12 Monkeys and Brazil are hardly "upbeat and optimistic for 90%." Gilliam is just a mad genius. I still suspect they killed him and used a doppleganger to film The Brothers Grimm so they could attach his name. God that movie was a big heaping pile of Santorum. I think the end of 12 Monkey was perfect. The thing is that even though they say form the beginning that you cna't change the past, you're so predispositioned to believe that if you know what has to be done to change things, you could do it. And it almost becomes a surprise when it's exactly like they said: nothing can be changed. In reality, that's the only way going back in time could work. Not just can you not change anything, but anything you do had always been done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbie Posted November 5, 2006 Author Share Posted November 5, 2006 (edited) I have an instinctive dislike for time loops. I find them illogical and annoying. 12 Monkeys borders on being a time loop. What's funny is that they don't give a good reason in the ovie as to how it is that time cannot be changed. I mentioned in an earlier post, how the authority in the future SENT a gun to Bruce Willis, EXPECTING him to change events. His failure to change the past doesn't come from any physical constraint, but rather the fact that he had failed before in the time loop. ------------------------------ Was reading a bit in the IMDB forums about Time Bandits. Lots of people had the same reaction I did to the ending. "WTF?" Gilliam addressed it in an interview and said that he killed the parents cuz the movie was about growing up and the kid had moved past the point of needing parents. (I guess having him move out and rent his own place with a couple of scantily clad female room-mates was too much of a demand) In any case, ready to move past his parents is one thing, being totally isolated from the world (no house, no other adults. The fireman drives off.) is very different. Edited November 5, 2006 by Jumbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Jax Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 What's funny is that they don't give a good reason in the ovie as to how it is that time cannot be changed. I mentioned in an earlier post, how the authority in the future SENT a gun to Bruce Willis, EXPECTING him to change events. His failure to change the past doesn't come from any physical constraint, but rather the fact that he had failed before in the time loop. On the contrary, it make PERFECT sense that the past connot be changed. If you could change the past, the future version of yourself that went back would never have existed. There would be a fraction in the timeline. Essentially, anything you do int eh past, it already happened, even if you didn't know about it. If you go back in time and try to prevent Linclon from being assassinated, it'd just turn out that anything you were alwasy part of that past and you just didn't know it,a dn anythign you did eventually lead to assassination. But if you DID prevent the asaassination, the future would be dramatically different and the exact version of you would never be born. That is a paradox. How can you change something if you never existed? Anythign you do int eh past was always part fo the history, you just didn't know about it. Madaline Stowe's character explains this with the Casandra complex. You go back and you don't change anything and you have always been the product the world that included your past self. It's the ONLY way time travel into the PAST could happen that makes ANY sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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