The NZA Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 I was just reading a commentary Robert Kirkman did about trades, and ive heard it a few times before - while Warren Ellis & guys like him think its the way of the future, others think its almost the opposite. On one hand, you get an arc, a full story, and at around $10-15 on average, mebbe a bit less than the comics woudlve been. You get no ads, sometimes extras like sketches and such, you never know. On the other hand - some complain that you get comics that are all written to be 5-6 issue arcs nowadays, with less crossovers/single issues as before. But the ponit Kirkman & some make are that guys (like myself) who "wait for the trade", while supporting the book, arent doing so in the most driect way. Let's say Krkman wants to do an indy zombie book, likie The Walking Dead, in a time when such books arent overly-popular. Image takes a chance, but if they dont see the sales figures each month, the book might not even make it to trade. And its hard tos sell a $15+ TPB if nobody seemed to buy your book at $2-3 a pop, rigtht? So, the comics themselves feel like chapters of the trade, like ads for the collected edition. Its not like movies and DVDs, because the industry, while doing better in recent years, still isnt stellar. Vertigo's played with the idea of realeasing a trade-only series. But how would this work? If you had a name like Gaiman on it, sure itd prolly fair alright, but such a system doesnt leave much room for the indy guys....most of us simply dont have the expandable cash to shell out nearly twenty bucks on something youve barely heard of. Creators now have preview pages on their sites, big lables run entire isssues for free in Wizard just for exposure on mainstream characters, and lets face it, even if i had large amoutns of discretionary income, im not buying a lot of the books on the Eisner nominee list each year, why am i gonna cough up a few hours worth of work for what might be 5-6 issues of crap in one book? So yeah, there's a few sides to this. Personally, even when i do have more $ to spend on comics, i see myself continuing supporting via trades for the books i like. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jables Posted March 21, 2006 Share Posted March 21, 2006 I do trades & issues. I prefer the serialised nature of issues I like having a good-looking bookshelf(and it's easier to pimp volumes than it is a stack of issues). If I know I'ma buy an arc when it hits trade, I'll usually 'skip' or not buy an issue so at least there's a part've the story I need the trade in order to read 'cause yeah, while the Millar Wolverine run'd look great in HC sitting on my desk, I've read it & couldn't be arsed shelling out another 60 bucks for it when I won't read it for another year or something. Runaways is another book that suffered/boomed the way Nick described. Sales on the title itself weren't doing much so it got cancelled. The trades moved faster than Walt Flanagan's dog, so it now has a volume 2(which I'm glad of, 'cause this book is great). I'd hate to see the whole industry slump 'cause people couldn't be arsed with monthlies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycaon Posted March 21, 2006 Share Posted March 21, 2006 I can see the argument concerning support for monthlies, but Trades make it easier for people to catch up on series they're behind on (and wouldn't have as much access to back issues of). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ganny McVagflaps Posted March 21, 2006 Share Posted March 21, 2006 I move around so much it's hard to keep regular issues. Trades are the way to go for me for that reason alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted March 21, 2006 Author Share Posted March 21, 2006 right, and i agree - but does it hurt the industry? writing is now done in arcs, and books rely on theri monthlies to make to to a trade...are some creators right to bitch that the book needs support on a monthly basis to stay alive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jables Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Yes. Yes they do. Not every book is gonna pull a Runaways. Publishers can't just turn every arc into trade unless they know they're gonna be bought 'cause they'd go under within a year(as long as they turn SpiderHunt & Identity Crisis(Spiderman's, not DC's) into trades first). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatDisciple Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 i think, no i am sure that trades will end up replacing single issues in the future. they're so much better, on entire story no commercials, extra sketches, bios, all that good stuff, DC makes somoe really good sketches, i cannot afford all those titles i wish i could read but trades make it a lot easier, its like an entire season on DVD... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted March 23, 2006 Author Share Posted March 23, 2006 right, but see, without the ads & such 1) comics dont make as much $, including the other books & merchendise they advertise in em 2) there might not be a big enough makret support to warrant a TPB. sure, guys like Warren Ellis can go do a project for Oni or another indie label & still be garunteed the book'll make a trade, but the up & coming guys might not get that. Skeeter used Runaways as an example, and that's from Vaughn - a repected writer on a Marvel book that involves superheroes. Granted, Marvel's standard of "failure" from sales is way above eveyrone else's but my point is: if a mainstream-friendly book like that can struggle, what about the independent books? Honestly, who here has ever paid $15-20+ on a trade from creators/characters/label you didnt know, and can you recall what kind of hype was required to get you to do that? ps not quite sure what a pic of you & Lobo has to do with bats, but uh, good show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jables Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 But how're the publishers to know what trades to produce? Seriously, there's a lot more involved in putting together a TPB, including all the 'DVD extras' everyone loves so much. Marvel's turning every peecashit book that comes across Joe Q's desk into trade & I don't know fuckin' how. Sure, I'm glad for it(I wouldn't have come across Peter David's Madrox otherwise), but it's not realistic. I'ma take a stab & say Joe Quesada & Brian Michael Bendis are spit-roasting Satan(because he's into that sort've thing, and his orifices excrete sulfuric acid) for the success & green they've seen this last few years, and that's why they can make trades of shit like Ghost Rider or Devil Dinosaur. DC doesn't have the movie deals Marvel has hence they can't churn out the trades ad-nauseum. All that aside though, I think I could just about give up comics if it became so... manufactured. The biggest thing I love about the industry is it's serialised nature. Suspence is the bread & butter of this industry, and once fans have to wait every 6 months to shell out AU30 bucks for a hit-or-miss story, they're just gonna give up too. Sorry Nick, didn't see your post until after this was in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted March 23, 2006 Author Share Posted March 23, 2006 right - though id venture the TPB thing as an initiative that Bill Jemas set up in 01/02 with bookstores when he - and rightfully so - questioned why the fuck a marvel book's a big hit when it sells 100,000 copies, while Tolyopop sells (over here, too) in the hundred thousands, or even the millions. Rather than do like manga - genre-work, for one - they opened themselves up to the bookstore market, a tactic that many direct market vendors (read: comic shops) didnt care for, but some understood its smart business: anyone reading comics is good for the industry. Ready, not speculating like in the early 90's. you also bring up a point i was hitting on with writing: not only does writing-arcs-for-the-trade mean 1) discouraging stand-alone issues and big crossovers 2) things have to wrap up neat & tidy by the arc's finish, or enough so to keep a new reader happy, yet comin back, but you also get the fact that cliffhangers - a pivotal part of comic writing - arent as big as they were. Read Preacher in TPB with the covers sometimes not even there to seperate the issues; major characters die on one page, and are brought back the next, cause you didnt sit through 30+ days of wiating. Some argue that something's lost, and if you bother talking comics here or elsewhere, or godforbid read Wizard, the biggest surprises will be spoiled for you inevitably - i know myself, SB, 2T & others have books they wait on the trades for, and you really gotta watch what you read to not know things like HOLY SHIT THEY JUST KILLED HAWKEYE IN ULTIMATES VOL 2 SHIT'S CRAZY RIGHT NOW CAUSE ULTIMATE JACKAL DID IT OH GOD and so on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jables Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Yeah, I was gonna wait for Identity Crisis to appear in trade to buy it, but then realised I'd be going without Wizard for what? I guess close to a year now? Yeah, see? The cliffhanger is effectively gone without strategic TPB placement. Preacher was actually pretty good for that though. Divvy up the nine volumes into even threes & it makes a solid trilogy(as per my idea over in the Divinity for a 3-volume HC set for the tenth anniversary), and I remember waiting the weekend between War in the Sun & Salvation & going abso-fucking-lutely insane with suspence. More'n anything though, if noone buying monthlies means I don't get the books I want when I want'em, I'ma be pissed an' come over there whalin' on all ya comic-downloading arses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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