Rick Ro$$

[The NZA]

unknown to you. a lot've shit is popular, you just might not have heard of it - again - by only checking 1 local hip hop/r&b station and another "party" one. the fact you're pointing to the latest crossover trend of electronic shit really shows that - it makes as much sense as saying only dirty south hip-hop got made in the early to mid 2000's - yeah, if you only fucked with the radio in your area.

 

does shit have to be popular to be good/likeable? how do you determine popular? like 2-3 artists went platinum last year. many others made millions, sold out tours and such, but since sales = respectability for you, you tell me when someone's legit.

 

none of what i was talking about has to do with Drake, and if you think R&B hook singing is new - come on. he's not the first, won't be the last, but let's move past the cranky old man yelling at clouds bit and get honest here.

 

I'm gonna make this easy - i don't like using comercial success as a metric (sales shouldn't matter to an MC, right?) so some of this is more well known, granted, but all of it got love/critical acclaim/influenced shit. if it got play, if it got rotation, talked about/critical acclaim, sounded good etc i'll count it here.

here's some of last year's albums, how many of these can you honestly say you listened all the way through/gave a chance?

 

 

Big K.R.I.T. - Return of 4Eva

ASAP Rocky - LiveLoveASAP

J. Cole - Cole World: The Sideline Story

Action Bronson - Dr. Lecter

The Roots - Undun

Danny Brown - XXX

Cunninlynguists - Oneirology

Freddie Gibbs - Cold Day in Hell

Drake - Take Care

Kendrick Lamar - Section80

Young Jeezy - TM03: Hustlaz Ambition

Curren$y & Alchemist - Covert Coup

No ID/Cocaine 80's - The Pursuit

Shabazz Palaces - Black Up

Gucci Mane & Waka Flocka Flame - Ferrari Boyz

Beastie Boys - Hot Sauce Committee 2

Big Sean - Finally Famous

Tyler the Creator - Goblin

Game - RED album

Lloyd Banks - Cold Corner 2

Common - The Dreamer, The Believer

Phonte - Charity Starts at Home

Tech N9ne - All 6's and 7's

Murs - Love & Rockets: The Transformation

The Weekend - Thursday

Thurz – L.A Riot

Schoolboy Q - Setbacks

Elzhi - Elmatic

9th Wonder - The Wonder Years

Dessa - Castor, The Twin

E-40 - Graveyard Shift

Tiron and Ayomari - Sucker For Pumps

Bumpy Knuckles - Lyrical Workout

Kool G Rap - Riches, Rap, Royalty

Slaine & Statik Selektah - State of Grace

Pharoahe Monch - W.A.R.

Madlib - Medicine Show No. 11 Low Budget High Fi Music

M.O.P. & Snowgoons - Sparta

Hail Mary Mallon - Are you gonna eat that?

DJ Quik - Book of David

XV - Zero Heroes

Childish Gambino - Camp

Saigon - The greatest story never told

The Illz - :03 from Gold

Das Racist- Relax

Yelawolf - Radioactive

Cities Aviv - Digital Lows

 

i've gone through 75%+ of this list, and im leaving off lots of stuff cause the point is made. Do your thing & tell me this list is all "hipster" cause you've not heard of much of it (and didn't listen to much of the names you have from there), then I can reply with whatever you want - sales figures, concert shit, reviews, twitter followers (haha) whatever arbitrary measurement you need for a household MC that doesn't make you nostalgic or something.

 

you tell me what "counts". because right now? it feels like i'm talking about comics (or apparently "the state of the industry") with someone who only watches the cartoons/movies.

[Mortiis558]

Shit E-40 and Tech N9ne alone make last year a good year, not to mention half of that list as well, not trying to say anything, just trying to say there is good stuff still out there even though I am kinda with Panch in saying rap is dead or is at the very least lost right now.

[Thelogan]

I've been hearing that for something like 15 years though. Shouldn't hip--POP be a separate category by now?

 

Dear Hip-Hop,

Please see that mixers and turntables are returned to Kool Herc.

The ghettos are dancing off beat.

The master of ceremonies have forgotten that they were once slaves and have neglected the occasion of this ceremony.

Perhaps we should not have encouraged them to use cordless microphones, for they have walked too far from the source and are emitting a lesser frequency

[The NZA]

i think it's growing pains. the radio end of mainstream is on some major league sports shit - there's more money than ever on the table, but it goes to a smaller and smaller number of people, and those usually have to know people and follow a formula to get there. i think it's (the rest is) branching out more than ever - old sounds and samples get used in different ways, and you get stuff like Witch House outta nowhere.

 

i mean, you could be right for what you like, but to me its like saying comics or another medium is dead - there's so much going on that there's literally more for everybody than there was at any point before, because digital music is letting people eat and live comfortably in some cases by doing what they want rather than having to just follow radio trends/cues (party shit > break/b-boy > afrocentric > wait now only gangsta shit sells > crunk > follow R&B into house, dance hall & reaggeton etc > whatever comes next).

 

E-water's got 3 albums dropping in march alone, that's crazy. was Tech N9ne good last year? i slept on that one.

 

logans - haha, you actually posted something hipster-ish, that was nice of you. for real though, what exactly would you put under hip-pop though? ringtone rap still happens but it's not as prevalent and if you point at say when Soulja Boy and shit was hot, somebody else would just look back and point at Kriss Kross, wouldn't they? i'm not sure i can narrow taht one down.

[Thelogan]

I'm pretty sure anyone who raps without affecting an urban gangsta dialect is considered "hipster". That's the line for most "open minded fans of the genre" that I know.

 

As for the line for pop, I can't draw one either. And that's exactly the problem.

[Mortiis558]

Just want it out there that I am NOT saying rap is dead. Panch did lol and I am sort of agreeing.

 

Because honestly I don't think this has to do with just rap or hip-hop in general. Every genre is going through some growing pains right now where you have the popular "radio friendly" bands, you have a shit-ton of independent musicians doing their own thing, plus a whole underground movement that has always been and always will be.

 

But with anyone with a computer and a mouth being able to make an album and put it up on CdBaby or Itunes, we are getting flooded with stuff that is good, but a lot of it is just shit because someone at some point in their life told them they were ok, just to shut them up, and now that person thinks they should make an album. And does.

 

Rap I don't really follow and have never followed. I have to befreind a black drug dealer and ask him what is good. Thankfully the last guy I did this with had a damn good opinion of rap and has shown me some great new shit. I don't think rap is dead, or any other genre, because people have been saying shit has been dead since there was a second band in a new genre. Omg Nirvana got airplay, Grunge is dead!! (though grunge has died, and has been rotting in the sun for quite some time now, so maybe that isn't the best example).

 

Back to the original topic at hand. 50 for me, is like what NZA said about Ross. For you Panch, he may seem like a throwback to a better era, but to me I don't get that feeling at all. The lyrics may be right, but 50 just doesn't have any feeling in his rapping. For me 50 is the epitome of the Hipster-hop you talk about. It may not have electronic stuff in it, but the whole vibe I get from 50 is he is in this for the money, not much else. He doesn't seem to try that hard, and given that he can say he feels like recording and then 2 hours later has a song out, in my eyes doesn't look good to me. Either he is just that good, or it really doesn't take much to make a new 50 song. Either way, he has led this new wave of hip-hop that I just can't get into.

[Panch]

I can respect that. Music, of course, is subjective and everything we're going back-and-forth about doesn't mean shit. I don't have a problem with anything you've said. Nick too. I like 50 and will always find his stuff cool and refreshing. TO ME! Yes, he's about the money and yes, he sometimes tweets that he's entering the studio and two hours later is releasing a song on youtube. But here's the thing that I love and respect about 50. In between albums... everything he creates... songs, freestyles, whatever he gives away... for free. Entire mixtapes can be yours. Given to you BY HIM. FOR FREE! I love this. It's like he cares about money, but doesnt. I mean, he knows by giving away music half the time, the other half you're gonna buy. I'm fascinated by this. In a world were acts cry about stolen music, this guy is giving it away. Even Rick Ross will release a mixtape to be purchased out of a trunk of a car or something.

 

I know a lot of folks are "rapping", but Mortis hit the nail on the head. The industry is saturated with just homeboys with a pen, pad and mic. Everyone raps about the same shit. For some reason I'm a creature of extremes. I prefer the most thugged out of music... while still reaching the widest audience. That's just me.

[Mortiis558]

It seems like more and more "made" artists are giving away more and more music for free. The biggest other contributor that I can think of right this instant is Nine Inch Nails, and him giving away a 4cd album for free. It was mainly just instrumentals and ambient type stuff, not full-fledged "songs" like he releases on other albums, but still the act of giving your fans something for free is something I will always support. I even went ahead and bought a copy of Ghosts when it was released at retail, just in hope of him doing it more, or other musicians doing it.

 

I am also a person of extremes. It is just that 50 has never come across as "extreme" to me. Take something like "Motherfucka Ain't Mine" by UGK, or "the Final Frontier" by MC Ren and those come across as extreme to me. Maybe not thugged out, but I do like that stuff too, and I try to find it, but I don't know 50 just doesn't hit that "extreme" feeling I like in rap. Though I will listen to him more as time goes on, and I will try and see if maybe someday I will start to feel something from his music.

 

In the meantime, Panch can you suggest some other examples of "extreme thugged out rap" I am really interested in finding more than the miniscule amount I currently know.

[Panch]

Rick Ross, to me, falls in that category. His beats and content are hard. DMX, Ghostface (and the whole Wu library, really - pick up that Wu-Massacre), "Hungry" Nas (as Nick likes to call him. His more commercial stuff can be skipped if you can help it... find his Lost Tapes. Good shit right there), Xzibit. Some would say Eminem, but he's grown soft on his solo stuff. Still, have you heard the Bad Meets Evil album? That deserves a listen. That's off the top of my head. I'll get back to you with more stuff.