Games that defined their genre

[gunsmithx]

So out of the thread on super metroid and how it defined so many games that came after I thought that these kind of games deserved their own thread.

 

I'm talking about games like Zelda, Ultima, Mario, FF, alot of the really good early stuff and even more recent trends, like GTA 3 or mario 64. Others I can name are Dune 2 in the RTS space, Quake for FPS,

 

One thing to note is that nintendo really lead the way for, early stuff like Zelda, the Mario games, the various metroids, to the current things like the Wii it's hard to agrue that any other company has done more to define genre's.

 

ok thats just a quickie, I'm at work atm so I'll add more later.

[Spycer]

Quake is the grand child of Wolfenstien by DOOM.

[Iambaytor]

True that, and Grand Theft Auto 3 simply redefined a genre that was defined by Grand Theft Auto 1 and 2 and also Driver and Driver 2.

[gunsmithx]

AH but GTA has basicly defined the concept of 3-d sandbox, see it did bulid upon 1 and 2 but I think GTA 3 really brought the whole thing together.

 

And yes Quake built upon wolf and doom(which I should have meantioned but it was first true3-d FPS(decent may have come out first but thats always been it's own thing, not a tradintional fps) and set the standerd for the genre. The same could be said for Half life which changed the way that FPS were done in terms of their presention and story telling.

 

Just because something wasn't the very first thing that came along doesn't mean that it didn't have a huge defining effect on their genre, otherwise everything just built on pong!

[Reverend Jax]

Quake is the grand child of Wolfenstien by DOOM.

 

And Faceball 2000 was Wolfenstein's daddy. Doesn't mean it defined the genre. In early pre-3D FPS, I think doom really defined the genre. I'm a bit bias to consoles, but I think Goldeneye was the game that defined that genre in 3D.

 

Also, while Nintendo didn't create Tetris, they were responsible having the confidence in it to elevate it and have it become the standard in puzzle games.

[Iambaytor]

Also, while Nintendo didn't create Tetris, they were responsible having the confidence in it to elevate it and have it become the standard in puzzle games.

 

Nintendo had a lot of things in Tetris, but confidence wasn't one of them. You should download the Icons episode for Tetris, it's kind of sad.

[gunsmithx]

And Faceball 2000 was Wolfenstein's daddy. Doesn't mean it defined the genre. In early pre-3D FPS, I think doom really defined the genre. I'm a bit bias to consoles, but I think Goldeneye was the game that defined that genre in 3D.

 

Also, while Nintendo didn't create Tetris, they were responsible having the confidence in it to elevate it and have it become the standard in puzzle games.

 

Goldeneye didn't really define it in terms of single player, but rather in terms of multiplayers which is where it's real strength lay. To this day playing GE with my friends for hours on end is something I fondly remember, and I'm far from alone in that, shame it never got a second game.

[Reverend Jax]

Well, there were other Bond FPS and also Perfect Dark, but none of them were as good s GE.

 

And Baytor, what the hell is Icons? Link?

[Iambaytor]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icons_%28TV_series%29

[The NZA]

some good ones so far. ill add:

 

 

took things up a notch cinematically, raised expectations (gameply and story-wise), all but recreated the concept of stealth in games. youve played dozens since that didnt do stealth half as well.

 

 

yeah, we had Alone in the Dark, Mansion of Hidden Souls, 7th Guest etc there was horror before, and possibly Survival Horror with the first name there, but not to this extent. series redefined itself at # 4, but it's still crazy influential.

im almost tempted to put 4 up alone, it was that fucking good.

 

 

obvious choice is obvious - this one was so big, so cinematic, it opened the tightly-closed JRPG floodgates for us here in the states. hate it or love it, that cant be underestimated.

 

 

Mario's platforming is obvious, but amongst all the spinoffs - even Mario Party, which has sold better overall, i wanna say? - this practically created a sub-genre of racing.

 

 

reminded Sony that 2D was all kinds of not-dead, revitalized interest in the series after the early abysmal 3D attempts, split the franchise right down the middle (we still get games of its kind on the DS).

 

 

some give it to Devil May Cry, which made it out fall of the same year. this is what God of War and so many 3rd person hack-and-slashes look like, even now. level up your weapons with souls, fight in challenge rooms, etc.

 

 

hate it or love it, past Goldeneye, this was the console FPS. we console kids had LAN parties of this one - excellent deathmatch options, regenerating shields (now a standard - im pretty sure they were there before Halo, but it made them the default...sorry medkits). there'd be no COD4 without this.

 

 

to contrast RE, this showed the market for true psychological horror. its worth stating that Fatal Frame and few others have managed to truly capture some of the Team Silent magic, but tons of ps1/2 games capitalized on looking similar.

 

 

this was, outright, the first time i recalled seeing the home version look better/bring more options than the arcade. Tekken 2 on PS1 was huge, mind, but this is (i believe) around where arcades truly started to die. by the time we started fighting online, it was over.

 

 

fuck your GTA. itd not even be here without this ambitious, amazing project.

Suzuki's swan song may've helped see him out the door, but this went so far (even online/realtime weather) to create a living environment for the player; no console game prior can be credited with trying this with half the effort.

 

 

yes, seriously. PSX is all over this list...this game commercially proved that localizing quirky japanese games could be worth the effort. i think elements of the industry had questions about this after Earthbound (sadly), and i cant help but feel we got Katamari and like games because of this series. americans/EU proved they too could "get it", even if it was all in the mind.

 

for sports, there's Sega Sports who pushed EA to step their game up (i love adding Victorious Boxers here, the PS2 localization of Hajime No Ippo, cause it completely changed Knockout Kings/Fight Night).

 

im forgetting so much here. Super Metroid has been stated - if were gonna say Mario, Zelda etc, someone pick specific games and run with em. itd be fun to talk about which ones this gen you see potentially being that way....off the top of my head, id say LittleBigPlanet will probably be bigger than it has been so far.

[gunsmithx]

Couple of points nick,

 

1. I love shenmue but it was way before it's time, and to be fair it wasn't a sandbox game the way that GTA was. that said it was incredibly ground breaking at the time. GTA took many things and was basicly a true 3-d sandbox which I would agrue that shenmue isnt' completely(it's deffinietly no where near as big.) Maybe it's just me but shenmue just feels more linar then GTA did but in terms of presentation, storyline and ambition it's hard to top this one, shame we will never know how the story ends(god I wish they would release the bible on this so we know what was supposed to happen... still pisses me off... time to pick it up again lol)

 

2. I hate to say this as much as I love symphony but it wasn't as defining as Super Metroid, if Super was never made i'm not sure we see this game, which is not something I would say of GTA 3 and Shenmue. Super was really the first of these games made and Symphony just kicked it up a notch. I love both games and still replay them to this day but Metorid is the game that really set the tone for the Genre.

 

3. FF7 for all thats it's lauded, for all that it set the tone for presetion and story telling and kick ass cg really does not hold up very well, and I'd say out of all their games FF 4 was the most groundbreaking at the time, but both games really changed the way that jrpgs were done much more then the first 3 games of the series. In fact out of all the games we've meantion I'd agrue that perhaps ff7 holds up the least, maybe tekken or RE.

 

As for games today that might set standered and define shit... LBP might for sure, not sure what else might, but I'll have to think on this for a bit... I'm sure george will make some comment on Tekken(crazy sega fan boy)

 

Oh and monkey island and those games and their ilk.... some really cool stuff that seems to be making a bit of a revial.

[Iambaytor]

What does Tekken have to do with Sega, or are you implying we're going to have the [dramticoverlude]Virtua Fighter discussion[/dramticoverlude]

[The NZA]

in terms of scope, sure, GTA III (later game) was way bigger. Shenmue II was huge compared to 1, though. and again, its odd to say it was way ahead of time & such but not influential (that's the direction i was taking from this thread). your cries for bish will only bring a short essay by him on your shenmue blasphemies.

 

no doubt Super Metroid is way huger/influential vs SOTN, i guess i was thinking in terms of within its own series. it did, however, impact in terms of "reviving" 2D at the time, i wanna say. at least enough for Sony to take note.

 

i used Tekken as the "break from arcades" point but there might be better choices, just what stood out for me. im sure there were other 3D fighters with bells & whistles before, but none that took off like that anyway. you can make arguments for Soul Calibur here, no dobut.

 

 

....wait, FF IV did a lotta changes for the series, but we're not discussing what holds up here, were talking influential, right? FF VII can not be dismissed/downplayed for that. we can talk about its overhype etc etc but cmon, graphics/cinematics werent stressed nearly as much before, and you remember the days of the genre being super-niche: this game is why that changed.

[gunsmithx]

I was more making a comment on how I thought that ff 7 held up least well in terms of aging not that it wasn't influential. It very much changed the way the genre was looked at and how the games were presented but it just doesn't hold up as well as many other genre defining games, at least for me.

[The NZA]

i suspect you're right, but ive not revisited it yet...grab skeet's copy on PSN but ive got it in my head, its been 10 years, and a remake is inevitable at some point.

again, VII's cinematics blew my mind, but even back then, by the time it was done, i wasnt thinking its story stood out, despite liking some of the characters....its why i had a hard time getting properly hyped for Advent Children (though Crisis Core was better than i expected). really though, the only FF from that era ive been tempted to try again (cause im fuzzy on some of the plot at this point) is IX, i remember liking it a lot.

[gunsmithx]

just don't do 8, wasn't even good at the time(and yes I know thats likely to start a debate, if you really want to fight me on it, catch me offline as I won't do it online) 9 was very good in that it was a love letter to fans basicly, a big thank you for sticking with the series and a send off before they changed the directions the series went.

 

Also untill you've watch Advent childern tripping you have not yet lived(though to be fair I was tripping my face off and I still thought the damn thing didn't make sense, though I completely though the phone call with the victory music was in my head till someone pointed it out)

 

FF7 does deserve a remake but I wonder if they would add in some sort of thing with aris as thats been such a huge fan point... ok enough off topic. 7 was what it was due to presention and basicly bening the first to do it that way. I'm still amazed we became as attached to those characters as we did.

[The NZA]

just don't do 8, wasn't even good at the time(and yes I know thats likely to start a debate, if you really want to fight me on it, catch me offline as I won't do it online)

 

please believe, you're preaching to the choir here. 8 has an excellent OST, and if i pretend the game ends with disc 1, i think it's great. nothing else past that works for me on any level.

 

god, if/when 7 gets redone, if they add a "YOU CAN UNDO THE ENDING AND SAVE AERIS" mode, im going to start smacking fans. ugh.

 

you put up Monkey Island (good call)....would you then put up Zork? id love to put up some more Shafer (i adored Grim Fandango, Psychonauts was great too) but i cant sit here & say they were mad influential.

did Gran Turismo get named? that prolly deserves a spot for stepping the racers up. oh, and SF II is ubiquitous.