The NZA Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 I'm just as worn-out of universe-wide crossovers as most of you, but this kind've one gets me all excited - basically, all the street-level vigilantes are coming together and it looks awesome. For those not currently reading Daredevil (seriously, what is wrong with you?): The Hand needed a new leader, and its worst enemey, Matt (DD) stepped up to the plate, largely so the Kingpin wouldn't. He's been trying to use them to cut back on the rise in crime seen during Norman Osborn's time at the helm (and has been largely successful, too), but much of the story has been about him trying to do this without being corrupted. during Dark Reign, Bullseye took out an entire city block in Matt's neighborhood, killing over 100 residents. Matt took the site and built Shadowland, his base of operations, now in plain view of the resurrected Avengers HQ. Matt's been too busy trying to not kill crooked cops formerly on Osborn's payroll to pay attention to the heavy hitters tying to make heads or tails of him...but he's about to cross a line that puts him at war with all his greatest allies. Issue # 1 of the event launched last week, written by Andy Diggle and following his new take on Matt (he's been writing Daredevil like a kung-fu drama for a while now, and it's been a really good take) he just keeps the arc going, showing how it's going to extend to Spider-Man, Punisher, Iron Fist & Cage, Moon Knight and the Avengers themselves. crazy cliffhanger ending shit's been coming a long time, though , cant wait to see where it goes next...anyone else reading this? Here's a better summary, plus checklist of where the event's going Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choose Life Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 If only i could add images to my topics,and i'm sure they would become much more interesting and stylish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 12, 2010 Author Share Posted July 12, 2010 heh...alright, that (kind of) counts as a reply. which topics of yours you feel got neglected without images? i only recall the one with the sport about the feets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 Enjoying this, but I'm one issue in and I'm already sick of Tan's art. He's not good. He's like a poor man's Tony Daniel, but after he went to DC and started to suck. The premise is awesome so I'm sticking with it, but I wish Marvel woulda gone a different route art wise. I wish Michael Lark was available, but he's busy penciling Spidey's Grim Hunt... or Maleev. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 12, 2010 Author Share Posted July 12, 2010 damn, harsh - Tan's not my favorite, but he never struck me as overly harsh-on-the-eyes. Grim Hunt's good, you're reading that? Lark's awesome too. i dunno, for me this isnt nearly as jarring as say JRJR on Avengers; dude makes me wish theyd put Copiel or someone on it, even if it only came out every 3-4 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 Does JRJR work for Avengers? Maybe not, but at least he's GOOD! Billy Tan SUCKS!!! Go back to your scan of Shadowland #1 and look at Iron Man. It's horrendous! Although Copiel is awesome, don't you want someone dark on Shadow? I don't know... I'm enjoying it, but not as much as I want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 13, 2010 Author Share Posted July 13, 2010 oh ho ho my scan he says im ready to say JRJR needs to be put out to pasture. unless he can be back on a daredevil mini or just go back to drawing spidey in the rain, ive got no use for him...i personally thought that double-page spread of like 30 avengers looking like the same dude was kinda embarassing. if the book's supposed to have a throwback art style, there's better people - who was that guy that drew the Shocker arc (down in the subway) last year on Amazing Spidey? his shit looked silver age and awesome. ...ok, im looking at it, and im seeing what you're saying @ Tony (some frames of Bullseye's escape are rough facial expressions, too). he's not great, true, but at least dark DD's getup, he's making that work, and the ninja fight's flowing better than say Templesmith. Tan's not ideal, but he doesn't make me want to not read the book like Greg Land and a few other dudes. to each their own, i guess...but for me? his work here, however sloppy, still > JRJR on action, stills, montages, almost anything. hate to say it, but i feel he's gotten worse with age. i forget if ive asked you this: how did you feel about Igor Kordey (sp)'s rush-job on New X-Men and other Marvel stuff from that time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choose Life Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 heh...alright, that (kind of) counts as a reply.which topics of yours you feel got neglected without images? i only recall the one with the sport about the feets. Its not a huge problem, just images grab ones attention I have no knowlege of Shadowland actually,so my apologies for that I was just captivated by that astonishing image Just realised its about other characters too,well i have heard of Daredevil and Punisher-thats as far as my knowlege goes on the subject Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 oh ho ho my scan he says I'm right, though... im ready to say JRJR needs to be put out to pasture. unless he can be back on a daredevil mini or just go back to drawing spidey in the rain, ive got no use for him...i personally thought that double-page spread of like 30 avengers looking like the same dude was kinda embarassing. if the book's supposed to have a throwback art style, there's better people - who was that guy that drew the Shocker arc (down in the subway) last year on Amazing Spidey? his shit looked silver age and awesome. Agreed that JRJR shouldn't be doin' team books (or just anything Thor, Iron-Man, any chicks, etc). I think he really works with street level folks. You know... all your favorites. I didn't read that Shocker arc. ...ok, im looking at it, and im seeing what you're saying @ Tony (some frames of Bullseye's escape are rough facial expressions, too). he's not great, true, but at least dark DD's getup, he's making that work, and the ninja fight's flowing better than say Templesmith. Tan's not ideal, but he doesn't make me want to not read the book like Greg Land and a few other dudes. to each their own, i guess...but for me? his work here, however sloppy, still > JRJR on action, stills, montages, almost anything. hate to say it, but i feel he's gotten worse with age. Dark DD is just a reverse costume! How can he not make that work? I admit it's genius, but that's not what I'm talkin' about. I just don't think this guy should be on a big event like this (it's big when DD gets his own event with tie-ins and all). This guy is X-23 minis at best. i forget if ive asked you this: how did you feel about Igor Kordey (sp)'s rush-job on New X-Men and other Marvel stuff from that time? Remind me who and what this question is about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 13, 2010 Author Share Posted July 13, 2010 I'm right, though... some of us buy trades. im lookin' at marvel's new digital subscription...we support shit different ways. stop hatin'! Agreed that JRJR shouldn't be doin' team books (or just anything Thor, Iron-Man, any chicks, etc). I think he really works with street level folks. You know... all your favorites. I didn't read that Shocker arc. this dude - i forget his name. it wasnt a bad arc, but his art was just really cool, felt like a modern take on a classic style. id love to see him on more shit. then again, JRJR makes me shake my head cause Copiel aint doing shit and McNiven is on like 1 book now. fuck, Deodato Jr kinda tore it up on Dark Avengers for a while there... i dont even want JR on say Moon Knight. yeah, its been years since Finch ( ) but even the last batch of guys weren't bad. and you saw what's-this-guy's-name David Aja on Iron Fist...talent is crawling out of the woodworks these days. Remind me who and what this question is about? Kordey got trashed by some fan communities for being marvel's go-to workhorse for a year or more there...i remember hating his style, then it growing on me, and the more i read about his concepts in interviews, the more i dug him...but even he mentioned he took on too much work & it got sloppy. im saying, we got different tastes (i didnt even really take too much note of Tan's pencils here), just wanted to see what you thought of his shit...i could link some, but i know you got his better works on New X-Men with morisson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 some of us buy trades. im lookin' at marvel's new digital subscription...we support shit different ways. stop hatin'! I refuse to believe you pay for any 'subscription'. this dude - i forget his name. it wasnt a bad arc, but his art was just really cool, felt like a modern take on a classic style. id love to see him on more shit. That's Marcos Martin! I love that guy! Did that Vaughn Dr. Strange book The Oath. I know him from other shit, but I can't think of it now. Runaways? Whatever, yeah the guy's style is awesome (gotta find those Shocker issues)! then again, JRJR makes me shake my head cause Copiel aint doing shit and McNiven is on like 1 book now. fuck, Deodato Jr kinda tore it up on Dark Avengers for a while there...i dont even want JR on say Moon Knight. yeah, its been years since Finch ( ) but even the last batch of guys weren't bad. and you saw what's-this-guy's-name David Aja on Iron Fist...talent is crawling out of the woodworks these days. You're right, JRJR shouldn't be on Mooney or whoever. Just DD and Spidey and maybe Punisher. Wait, isn't Punisher Franken Castle now? How is he in Shadowland? Fucking Marvel... Kordey got trashed by some fan communities for being marvel's go-to workhorse for a year or more there...i remember hating his style, then it growing on me, and the more i read about his concepts in interviews, the more i dug him...but even he mentioned he took on too much work & it got sloppy. im saying, we got different tastes (i didnt even really take too much note of Tan's pencils here), just wanted to see what you thought of his shit...i could link some, but i know you got his better works on New X-Men with morisson. Ooooh, I know Kordey! Eh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 14, 2010 Author Share Posted July 14, 2010 Enjoying this, but I'm one issue in and I'm already sick of Tan's art. He's not good. He's like a poor man's Tony Daniel, but after he went to DC and started to suck. just wanted to say; re-read the issue, and...this comment was spot-on and not harsh. not sure why im so forgiving on this shit, but some of the facial expressions (and as panch said, the Avengers in particular) are pretty awful. here's to hoping he doesnt helm the whole of the event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimsonfire Posted July 19, 2010 Share Posted July 19, 2010 Just read #1. Why is Iron Mans head so small compared to his strangely elongated torso? Gotta say though the fight between DD and Bullseye looked pretty cool. Haven't read anything of the NY heroes really but this looks interesting nonetheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 19, 2010 Author Share Posted July 19, 2010 you saw the checklist at the end, right? last week's Daredevil was part 2, and drawn far, far better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimsonfire Posted July 19, 2010 Share Posted July 19, 2010 Just read it. The art was interesting alright. I see Elektras not dead. I didn't have any prior knowledge of her death apart from it being mentioned in the previous issue so the big reveal at the end was sort of wasted on me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 19, 2010 Author Share Posted July 19, 2010 *shrug* she's dead and then alive so much at this point, i took the surprise to just be her involvement...though since i wanna say she was one of the last leaders of the Hand (wait, that was Skurll-Elektra...), cant find it too surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 19, 2010 Share Posted July 19, 2010 Just read it. The art was interesting alright. I see Elektras not dead. I didn't have any prior knowledge of her death apart from it being mentioned in the previous issue so the big reveal at the end was sort of wasted on me. Wikipedia helps with these things... Elektra was fatally stabbed by Bullseye with one of her own sai in a battle over which of them would be the Kingpin's assassin. Elektra managed to crawl over to Daredevil's house before dying in his arms as Bullseye watched the two, hidden among a crowd that had gathered to see what was going on. Later, members of The Hand stole her body and attempted to resurrect her. Daredevil, with the assistance of Stone, a member of Stick's order, intervened, defeating The Hand ninja. Daredevil then tried to revive Elektra himself. Although his attempt failed, it did have the effect of purifying Elektra's soul. Elektra's body subsequently disappeared with Stone. Some time after her partnership with Wolverine ended, it was revealed that when Elektra was resurrected by Stone, Elektra's evil aspect had been physically split apart from her in its own body as a consequence of the ritual performed by Daredevil. Her darker half, calling itself Erynys, fought Elektra and was killed by her, thus returning the dark side to Elektra's soul. Elektra seemingly reappears, appearing to be corrupted by the Hand. She kills, resurrects, and imprisons the vigilante Maya Lopez, intending to use her as a weapon. The New Avengers rescue Lopez and she ends up stabbing Elektra to death. However, upon her death it is revealed that "Elektra" is actually a Skrull in disguise; its death indicates that the Skrulls have become undetectable to even the heightened senses of New Avengers members Spider-Man, Wolverine, and Doctor Strange. The corpse is given to Iron Man by Spider-Woman. Mighty Avengers #16 reveals that Elektra was selected to be replaced by a Skrull imposter named Siri. She was targeted by several Skrull impostors while staying in Japan, however, Elektra fought and killed most of these Skrulls (including Siri), before being blindsided and severely beaten by a Super Skrull manifesting Invisible Woman's invisibility and Colossus' organic steel armor. A Skrull named Pagon took Elektra's place since Siri was killed by Elektra. Pagon's death was planned all along, being their major "reveal" of their intent to take over the world's superheroes. The real Elektra was revealed to be alive upon one of the Skrull Ships and was released during the final battle between the heroes and the Skrulls. Iron Man immediately orders her held in protective custody at S.H.I.E.L.D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 27, 2010 Author Share Posted July 27, 2010 BIG OL' SPOILERS IF YOU AINT READ # 1 YET Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 I still don't understand, though. Killing Bullseye makes you a villain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Visitant Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 You know what, i'm going to go a little bit out on a limb here. In all my years of reading comics I never thought Daredevil was a good character. You guys however really seem to enjoy this stuff. Now I haven't read him since like...the early 90s so toss a couple good trade names my way that I can see if I can get back into him because this does sound kinda interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 You, sir... have a lot of reading to do: Daredevil Volume 1 - "Guardian Devil" (#1-8) - Kevin Smith's take on everyone's favorite Man Without Fear. Also credited with making the character cool again after Frank Miller. Daredevil Volume 2 - "Parts of a Hole" (#9-15) - David Mack's contribution. Not the best of what I'll be posting, but still deserves a read (don't let Nick know I said that). Daredevil Volume 3 - "Wake Up" (#16-19) Daredevil Volume 4 - "Underboss" (#26-31) Daredevil Volume 5 - "Out" & "Trial of the Century" (#32-40) Daredevil Volume 6 - "Lowlife" (#41-45) Daredevil Volume 7 - "Hardcore" (#46-50) - Brian Michael Bendis! Volumes 3 through 7. Now this is the meat of the awesomeness that you're missing. Daredevil Volume 8 - "Echo - Vision Quest" (#51-55) - David Mack again (him and Bendis are buddies). Better than the first arc. Still a must read for continuity sake. Daredevil Volume 9 - "The King of Hell's Kitchen" (#56-60) Daredevil Volume 10 - "The Widow" (#61-65) Daredevil Volume 11 - "Golden Age" (#66-70) Daredevil Volume 12 - "Decalogue" (#71-75) Daredevil Volume 13 - "The Murdock Papers" (#76-81) - Volumes 9 through 13. More Bendis goodness (and the reason you wanna have Matt Murdock's love child by now). Sadly the end of his run, though. Daredevil: The Devil Inside and Out Volume 1 - "The Devil in Cell-Block D" (#82-87) Daredevil: The Devil Inside and Out Volume 2 - "The Devil Takes a Ride" (#88-93) Daredevil: Hell To Pay Volume 1 - "To The Devil His Due" (#94-99) Daredevil: Hell To Pay Volume 2 - "Without Fear" (#100-105) Daredevil: Cruel and Unusual (#106-110) Daredevil: Lady Bullseye (#111-115) Daredevil: Return of the King (#116-119, 500) - Ed Brubaker's best imitation of Bendis. Start with those and call me in the morning. You WILL NOT be disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 27, 2010 Author Share Posted July 27, 2010 I still don't understand, though. Killing Bullseye makes you a villain? aw, c'mon! you know Matt's crossing a line there; he's like spitting distance from Avengers tower in a post-reg world, they're gonna have to regulate. kinda figure that's the crux of this event, no? imagine if pete had killed kingpin in back in black! that would've been crazy, and then tony would've had to hunt him like...wait, no, forget this looking back: you're right @ Parts of a Hole, and you certainly cant enjoy "Vision Quest" without that setup, so i cant fault that one bit. but according to amazon, that's only #'s 9-12...i only point this out cause curiosity about pre-Bendis stuff made me read the other arc once, and it's a really shitty story about DD on mock-trial that involves some Mephisto/Brand New Day type shenanigans; its literally the kind've arc you could read in the 90's and forget about instantly, and stands out like a sore thumb between those awesome writers (hence why it's not in trade, thank god!), but anyway Bindu, if you stick to panch's excellent recommendations, you're in for an awesome time. only thing i can add is that Smith's DD and Bendis feel very different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted July 28, 2010 Share Posted July 28, 2010 Peter Parker COULD NEVER cross that line. If Kingpin killed the entire planet, Peter would still just throw him in jail with a lifetime supply of cupcakes and shit. It's his character. Matt Murdock on the other hand, could. And the one person that he would sacrifice his humanity for... is Bullseye. The motherfucker is EVIL. Almost on the level as the Joker. There's no goodness in those types. Killing them means saving thousands... OR MORE! Killing Bullseye doesn't make DD a villain in my eyes... it makes him a hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The NZA Posted July 28, 2010 Author Share Posted July 28, 2010 well, you know im in complete agreement here (did you think Pete could've crossed the line with that sniper if aunt may would've died right then & there, though? i'm not talking Ned Leeds, i mean, moment of not holding back...!), but yeah, you should check out this thread, be interested to see what you'd have to say on it. ps this shit is so sexy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panch Posted August 5, 2010 Share Posted August 5, 2010 Shadowland #2 GHOST RIDER! This is the best 90s book EVER! Wait, this ain't the 90s? Still, I feel like I'm 13 again! Shadowland: Bullseye One Shot FUNERAL FOR BULLSEYE!? This is the worst modern book EVER! We're not in the 90s anymore, dude. Fuck! I feel like I'm 13 again. Can't get enough of this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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