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X-Men 2: United

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This film has the best opening scene of any action film I've ever seen. Nightcrawler kicks so much ass, that it nearly made me cry with joy. Wolverine also actually kills people, they are anonymous soldiers but its still fucking cool to see him cutting loose.


Theres so many easter eggs in this film, it'll keep any X-Men fan on their toes. I'll not spoil it, but just keep a look out for when Mystique hacks into the computer.

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Remy Le Beau anyone.


You notice the name of doctor - Hank McCoy(sans the fur)


They should have given Colossus a better role though.


Ah Nightcrawler, I cant begin to say how good he was

Edited by deacon
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Ok, the comments about X2 are starting to scatter over the forum, so here's the thread. What did you all think? By the way, spoilers everywhere here.


I thought it was fun fun fun. Better than the first. Lots of great scenes, all the fights were spectacular, cerebro was reeeealy cool. The storyline was serviceable. But all very fun. Good to see wolverine killing people, he's the best at what he does and all that. Nightcrawler was great, and he had the potential to suck. He seemed like an unfilmable character and they turned him into the highlight of the movie. Lady deathstrike was little more than a henchman, but she was a fuckin cool one! Can't say enough about all those fights. As far as the story goes, this one was nothing special, but could be a chunk of a really good overall story. This could stretch out to be a huge franchise, fuck a trilogy, they could make lots and lots of these. It could be really episodic if they wanted it to be, there's certainly plenty of material. They're already moving into the phoenix thing, which would make for great plot along with the action. So, basically, this movie was plenty of fun, with potential for greatness later with tighter scripts with more substance to them and more movies to tell the story in.

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Well, I think that the new X-man movie was amazing as well. The movie was definitely ten times better then the first. Some amazing things that made the movie stand out was Nightcrawlers attack and Magneto's escape. There were a few minor details that made the plot a little convolted. Lady Deathstrike wasn't really given any character and William Stryker took too much of a role in a lot of the characters past. I'm also pretty darn sure that Lady deathstrike didn't have healing abilities which changes a lot when it comes to indurance. William Stryker also killed his son when he was born in the comics. But all in all I guess the plots would have to fuse in order to put so many characters in one and to make a good story. So even with these minor annoyances the movie was still quite good.

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Overall, I thought it was a better movie than the first one (and that's sayin' somethin' because the first one was pretty good), probably because they don't have to bother with backstory anymore. Hell, even with the few new characters they introduced they didn't bother with much backstory. Anyway, here's my rundown of the good, bad, and ugly. And it's surprisingly spoiler-free, since you learn about most've this from the trailers.


The Good -

Nightcrawler's opening scene deserves to be considered one of the best fight scenes in movie history along with the lobby fight in The Matrix, and the rooftop battle in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon.

It was nice to see Wolvy really let loose, finally. The man should kill people more often, it's surprisingly satisfying.

Brian Cox proves once again that he can play a villain better than just about anyone out there.

The actor who played Senator Kelly (whose name unfortunately escapes me right now) actually remembered to play the part from a more feminine standpoint since he's just Mystique in disguise. Dunno how many actors woulda actually thought that through.

Colossus looked frickin' awesome! They need more of him in X3.

Seeing the imperfections and actual noble parts in Magneto's character was nice. Villains are much better when they're more complex like that.

The scene where Iceman tells his parents about his powers. I wonder if they would have taken it better if he just told them he was gay?


The Bad -

Still no Gambit (sigh).

Still no Beast (sigh again).

References to both of them, though, but 's not enough.

Why does the villain always need some sorta big gadget that is capable of killing everybody? These guys make the bad guys from the Bond movies look like pussies. I'm kinda hoping the bad guys in X3 have better evil plans.

In the comics, wasn't Iceman the hothead (so to speak)?

Wolvy's fight with Lady Deathstrike. I wasn't all that impressed. Maybe if I had sat at the very back of the theatre I could have followed it easier, but I doubt it. I thought his fight with Mystique in the first one was much better (he's got a thing for fighting women, huh?).

Come to think of it, Deathstrike herself was kinda weak and under-used.


The Ugly -

James Marsden trying to act like he's crying while wearing a visor on his face. God, don't let him play Jesse Custer, please!

Does a dam really take that long to break? (this isn't even a spoiler because everybody knows that, in a movie like this, if they show a dam, it will end up breaking)

Out of all the cool cars in the X-garage, they chose a Mazda?!

Finding out Cyclops' choice of music when Pyro turns on his cd player in said crappy Mazda.

The movie is filled with characters who can control weather, make things float with their mind, read thoughts, transform into anyone, disappear at will, and walk through walls...so why does it still focus on the guy with claws? Wolvy's cool and all, but they're gonna need to start moving on to other characters soon before this turns into the Star Trek series (what? another Picard/Data storyline?! Bastards!). Maybe in the next one they'll focus more on, oh I dunno...Jean Grey?

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Wolverine is my favorite X-man by far and all of this, and they do him well enough, but he will never be nearly as cool a character as he is in the comics. He's great in the comics because of his inner monologue, running commentary on what's healing at any given moment and enormous amount of history. They simply can't cram that all into the movie. All they're focusing on is "ooo a mysterious past" bah, everyone in the movies has a mysterious past. As cool as wolvie is, they need to focus on someone else in the movies, cause in the movies, he's just a good fighter with claws. And the fight between him and lady deathstrike reminded me of "Death Becomes Her," it was kinda funny. I thought deathstrike was fine tho. She shouldn't be a major character, there needs to be a henchman to provide a good fight scene, and a hot asian is a good pick. The depth put into magneto is good, he still seems a bit too insane tho, I wish they'd justify his anti-human stance a bit more. As far as the gadget goers, the plot itself was nonexistant, just a reason to get the story moving along. It was as significant a plot as most 3 issue story arcs. Hopefully when they move into the phoenix thing the plot will matter as much as the action. As far as changes from the comic book go, I could care less, if I wanted the comic, I'd read it, and anyways, if you think the movie is inconsistant with the comics, the comics are filled with more inconsistencies than the bible.

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Remember when they tried to make us think that Wolvie was Sabertooth's son?


They got the phoenix thing coming up.


[i haven't seen X2, so I don't know what's in it]


They got the Morlocks and Mr Sinister (there's a name that sounds like shit in a movie...) That'd be a goo place for Sabretooth to come back as well as Gambit and the Beast.


Then there's Apocalypse, and his four horsemen. The Legacy Virus, Cable and the new mutants,


Man there's soooo many good ideas. If they could make 10 Trek movies, they can make 10 X movies. Just like the comics, the linups can change.


Does anyone besides me think that after a few sequels, it'd be awesome to see an Age of Apocalypse movie?

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They sure do have a lot of ideas but some of them don't make for successful movies.


If they start moving it into space with the Shiar empire for the Phonix story, it could start becoming less appealing to the general public as they could start seeing it as a sci-fi movie which is'nt everyones cup of tea.


I'd like to see the Sentinels personally

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This movie was great. As far as your complaints go, I understand your longing to see characters like Gambit and Beast, but characters can bog down a movie, and they're juggling so many already. I like how they introduce Iceman and Pyro almost as gimmicks in the first one just to make they real characters later. That's a great trend. Strom actually became a decent character, unlike in the last one. X-Men is the kind of series that needs time to have several developed chacaters, and introducing or developing too many at a time won't work. I'm pysched to see as many of these movies as the cast and filmmakers are willing to do.

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OK, there's not much I didn't like about the movie but here's what I thought could've been better:


1) Sabretooth: I'm going to miss that guy if he doesn't come back for part 3. There's tons of bad blood there that the writers haven't touched since that fight over the Statue in part 1. Would be sad if he just fell through the boat in part 1 and that's it, no more Sabretooth. He should've been at Akali Lake also, maybe to get his shit kicked in by Lady Deathstrike, emphasizing just how bad ass she is.


2) Lady Deathstrike: Too bad they didn't pay her more against wolvies emotions. No "love-affair-gone-bad", but then again, it would probably take another 15 - 30 minutes just to explain that part of his life. You don't really get a sense of how bad she really is until towards the end, she just storms around alot and asks stupid questions "Hey! What are you doing here!?". To someone who hasn't followed the comics (huh?), you don't understand how a lil chinese girl can kick Cyclops' ass in 2 seconds while taking a blast to the chest... although you get the idea that there's something fishy.


3) Obviously they're pulling the Phoenix card, but they should leave the Shiar out of it... but they're going to need a big bad boss to pick on, because I think the Phoenix will be too much for the enemies they've encountered so far.


Looking at the current roster for X3:


Wolvie, Cyclops, NightCrawler, Rogue, Iceman, Colossus, Storm on for sure.

In X1 they had a preview of Quicksilver, don't know if he'd be interesting enough... oooh, maybe as a bad guy... Brotherhood of Evil Mutants... yeah maybe they can pull some hot redhead for Scarlet Witch?

I don't think Gambit will make it, they've already given Rogue a boyfriend, they can deal w/ the story from that angle.

Beast made a lil cameo (good eye Nick), maybe he'll make it as a full fledged character.

The story needs some really bad guys... Juggernaut would rock.. get one of the guys from the World's Strongest Man competition on ESPN. White Queen would be cool... cast Gwyneth Paltrow. Omega Red? Cyber? I think Cyber's cooler & more menacing, but Omega's more popular. Apocalypse would make me shit my pants... I know I may sound stupid but ever since I saw that godawful Batman w/ Arnold as Mr. Freeze, all I thought was how cool that guy would look as Apocalypse. As long as its not the bad guy from Mortal Kombat 2.

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Juggernaut. Character-wise, that'd be cool, but I hope to god they find some excuse to redesign that costume, because that will not translate to film very well without being the epitome of cheese. I wanna see them bring in the Sentinels. They're setting so much up with the "war" between mutants and humans, it seems like an obvious direction to go in.


And new heroes for X3? Hmm, well they'll probably give Colossus a bigger role. It seems like every mutant that made a cameo that showed their power in X1 got a bigger part in X2 - Iceman, Pyro, even Kitty Pryde, though she got about 5 years younger. So hopefully Colossus will get a role, and they'll get a big enough budget to afford the makeup effects required for Beast. And, I dunno, what about Angel? They could bring him in as long as they found a way to keep him from looking like he got lost on the way to the Dogma set. Or Jubilee. She's been in both movies, now, and she hasn't even gotten a line of dialogue, yet.


Hey, Chiefy, where was Quicksilver in X1? Also, I've seen it twice now and I still didn't catch Beast's reference. I saw Gambit's name on the computer screen Mystique is looking through (she stops on it for a second just before she gets to Magneto) but I didn't see Hank's mention. Where was it?

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Wow, so much to say. First off: fuckin great movie, i wasnt just watching for m'boy Wolvy (the highlight, of course). Here's some thoughts.


-No, no trek comparisions, most of those flicks suck. Gimme part 3 and my Wolvy solo flick im hearin bout.


-Wolvy's a more interestin character. The audience may not know the background, granted, but i can still see him comin off more interestin - the script it set up that way as he's a far more developed character. I didnt think he hogged the screentime, but im biased.


-No, no, no Apocalypse, Sinister, Onslaught, Cyber, Omega etc...you really think theyd transfer over well? Maybe Apoc if he's in that egyption/Mummy type, eh... If it was up to me, part 3'd be Sentinels, mebbe Days of Future Past, tops (far simpler than Age of Apocalypse). Also, if you dont think the Phoenix saga can be done outside of space, you should read Ultimate X-Men. And im with Chief: for godsake, leave the Shi'ar out of it.


-Colossus gettin more time might be cool, i think the fans wanna see Gambit. Im not hyped on Beast, but after seein em nail Nightcrawler, id give it a shot, you know? Angel, Jubilee, etc...keep em as cameos, lets not fill the roster too much just cause some guys are finally gettin definition.


-Sabretooth - Only in the wolvy solo flick, i think he's done for the series. Was fun, but if anythin...did anyone else hear the 1st draft of the script had Juggernaut fightin the US military? Thatdve been cool, a la The Hulk.

And yeah, Deathstrike was cool, but she's done too...


Singer was right, once the charicterization's done, you can really put somethin good out there. Im dyin to go see this one again this weekend if you guys are down. :D


PS as a huge comic fan/fanboy, i like it when they fuck with the details & make it work, like makin Stryker military, not religuos, and meshin him with Dr Cornelius (Weapon X program); whatever works for the flick. Make the book reflect your good ideas, like how past X-Men 1 revamped the X-costumes, a huge plus.

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Hey, Chiefy, where was Quicksilver in X1?

Quicksilver was playing basketball with the kids outside. When he scored the kids started chanting "No powers, no powers!" cause he ran a circle around them.


I think if they don't do Apocalypse, they shouldn't do Angel. Thinking about this again, the Sentinel idea is pretty good, but who would be the final bad guy of the series? They'd have to do a really good job to keep the Sentinels from looking corny. I mean, in 2005 we still won't have nuclear fusion power, so how the fuck are there going to be 50 foot tall Sentinels wandering around like nothing special?


Hey, howabout throwing Havok against his brother?!

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I mean, in 2005 we still won't have nuclear fusion power, so how the fuck are there going to be 50 foot tall Sentinels wandering around like nothing special?

Well considering their are mutants who can manipulate fire, control our minds and teleport in the year 2003. Im sure they'll find a way of explaining.


And SB, the Beast reference is on the news, they're interview Dr.Hank McCoy(sans the fur).

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Sentinels can look however the director wants, ya know? Not big purple machines if he has somethin cooler in mind, and yeah i can buy it. Toss in the Phoenix force and i think youve plenty to deal with, godforbid you try the "Days of Future Past" along with alla that.. :D

Havok could be cool, but dont their powers negate each other? Think of part 2 - last bad guy was Strker & that worked, i think they can do it.

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I remember hearing from Stan Lee that when he created X-Men in the 60s, he thought that the prejudice and discrimination and hatred mutants faced and their struggle to be equals was a methapor for the civil rights movement (X-Men = SCLC, Brotherhood of Mutants = Black Panmthers?).


But in this movie, I felt that mutants are more similar to homosexuals. I noticed this when Iceman's mother said 'have you tried...not being a mutant' which is similar to what homos hear alot. It makes more sense most of the time because with most of the time, you can't tell a mutant in public (except for Beast and Nightcrawler and a few others). Anybody else noticed this?

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Yeah I agree, and I think the storylines hint a little more towards that connection now (Ian McKellen certainly likes to think so). I'd say that's probably a reflection of the times. When X-Men was first created it was a metaphor for civil rights because that was the major issue of the time. These days homosexuals are the biggest example of a group of people persecuted for who they are. If there are still X-Men comics three decades from now who knows what connection people will be making.

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If you like that angle, check out Grant Morrisson's clever New X-Men, where the mutant counter cultere of music, fashion etc reeks of society's take on homosexuality.

Yes, that was a clever line. And Stan barely invented the X-Men, id credit Jack Kirby more so, not to mention Buscema, Cleremont, Byrne etc and the ones who created the current roster of Wolvy, Storm, Collosus, Nightcrawler etc - just for the sake of trivia, the original batch was just Cyk, Jean, Beast, Iceman, and Angel..pretty boring, the book actually bombed the first go at it.

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