Mac or PC?

[daytripper]

Today's job interview really opened my eyes I heard stuff about Macs lately, but completely did not expect what I saw today. So I'm left a bit confused. Mac impliments a lot of open source programs and the eMac I was goofing with was great. So anyone have any experiences on Macs? Please I want to know!

[dante]

I never bothered with them really. I had a couple of Apples in my heyday, but I switched to PCs rather quickly with the invent of Wolfenstein 3D and DOOM hehe

[daytripper]

One Laptop Per Child - a Preview of the Hundred Dollar Laptop | Ethan Zuckerman

 

 

... I'd been calling the project the sub-hundred dollar laptop... the acronym of which is the unfortunate "SHiL". Negroponte's now calling the project OLPC - One Laptop Per Child. It does a better job of defining the project, I think - not taking the bottom out of the consumer laptop market, but providing a learning tool for students around the world.

 

... The mockup I saw was about the size of a large paperback book. There's a stiff rubber gasket around the edge of the machine, which can double as a stand. The keyboard on the mockup was detachable, but will probably fold out on a hinge. The system is designed to work in three modes: laptop mode (screen up, keyboard down, handle behind as a stand); book mode (screen on the front, keyboard on the back, comfortable indentation for holding it in the left hand. Pressing on the keyboard "accordian-stype" - as Negroponte puts it - allows for page scrolling); and game mode (screen in the front, keyboard in the back, held sideways, like an oversized PSP. Two trackballs, surrounded by four way buttons, on each side of the screen act as controls, and function keys on the back act as additional buttons.)

 

... A small team of Red Hat engineers are customizing a Red Hat distro to the processor and hardware specifications of the machine. They're doing some work on the GUI as well, as are Alan Kay and Seymour Papert - the total development team is about 18 people, including Kay's students at the media lab. The machine will come with tools to encourage students to experiment with programming, including Squeak (a graphical environment for the Smalltalk programming language) and Logo. The plan is to make the software available online in a few months so that testers can bang on it and suggest features.

 

... The laptop is not "for sale" - it's going to be available for students only, and will be distributed through the same channels that school books and uniforms are. The laptops will be the property of children, not of the school.

 

... Should it be a requirement that schools implementing laptops have internet connectivity? Can this connectivity be used the way it is in the SchoolNet Namibia project, to let schools become ISPs, using revenue to subsidize the net connection and, perhaps, the laptops? Will businesses repair the laptops? Or will students do it informally, or start their own businesses?

 

One Laptop Per Child is an amazingly ambitious and radical project. If it succeeds, it will radically change how the world learns, communicates and interacts over the next couple of decades. And if it fails, it will likely scare off anyone from trying anything this radical in technology and education for many years to come. For that reason alone, I'd like to make sure it doesn't fail, and would the help of the WorldChanging community in figuring out ways to make sure it succeeds.

 

more...

 

Nice to see people thinkng of the children in a non-MJ kind of way. Besides, it won't be long before something like this is reverse engineered and made publically availible.

[The NZA]

When RA sees this, she'll prolly chime in - she's our resident mac spokesperson, as i recall.

[daytripper]

yeah we need some more Mac Genuisuses up in here! I have so many questions! CooOOOommmMMmmEEee to mMMeeeEee!!111!!

[Jesi]

I love my mac.

 

 

 

 

Thank you, good night!

 

 

 

No, seriously. I think this concept of cheap laptops for educational purposes is a great idea, especially if they're distributed in countries where kids wouldn't get the opportunity otherwise. Obviously my preference is for the world to be Apple-oriented, but that's just not feasible, economically. I like that Red Hat is coming in to do the operating system, stepping away from the big two conglomerates to a) make the price cheaper and b) provide an independent learning arena for the kids involved in this project. On the flip side to that, I think that if Bill Gates and Steve Jobs reached deep enough into their pockets, they could afford to contribute hardware or software to this project without a second thought. But I understand and appreciate that it's being created exclusively with students in mind, not being sold in the primary market.

 

Anyway. As for DT's comment, I'm not a mac genius, but if you have questions I'll be happy to provide answers or at least find them for ya

[daytripper]

Yeah, I was happy to see that kids will be taught (if this project goes through) on a Linux platform. Years and years of kids taught on a microsoft platform has helped Gates KBE (I have to laugh at his knighthood by the Brits, I could have swore he was the one screaming like a b*tch when he had a pie tossed at him) have a iron hold on the market. But unfortuneately, I see M$ making a OS for the project for, as Chef would say, the "childr'un". This would make him a saint in the public eyes and help continue keeping it a M$ world (define brainwash).

 

Anyways, back to the mac. It runs on a unix platform, so 'splain to me how does it work with Linux products. Are the programs easy to install? For the while I had dual boot I remebered that the whole compiling new programs was a pain. And also I heard that new macs are being released to support intel chips? The world is dying to know!

 

(PS: know anyone that plays games like WoW on it? Impressions?)

[Jesi]

Yeah, I was happy to see that kids will be taught (if this project goes through) on a Linux platform. Years and years of kids taught on a microsoft platform has helped Gates KBE (I have to laugh at his knighthood by the Brits, I could have swore he was the one screaming like a b*tch when he had a pie tossed at him) have a iron hold on the market. But unfortuneately, I see M$ making a OS for the project for, as Chef would say, the "childr'un". This would make him a saint in the public eyes and help continue keeping it a M$ world (define brainwash).

 

Anyways, back to the mac. It runs on a unix platform, so 'splain to me how does it work with Linux products. Are the programs easy to install? For the while I had dual boot I remebered that the whole compiling new programs was a pain. And also I heard that new macs are being released to support intel chips? The world is dying to know!

 

(PS: know anyone that plays games like WoW on it? Impressions?)

 

Ooookay, delving a bit deeper into the realm of Mac than I'm familiar with, but here goes. Yes, the Mac OS platform is based on Unix programming. It's starkly different from microsoft in more ways than I have years of my life to count. What sticks out most in my mind is that each program is self-contained. In M$ programming, all of your base data information is accessed through one central library of files (your registry). If that fails, nothing works. In a Mac, say I run Photoshop into the ground and break it (hard to do, trust me). If that program crashes, it's not going to take the entire system down with it, because all of the necessary framework for that program is condensed into one self-contaned application. Each app has its own set of protocols when running so that it doesn't affect the way the rest of the system works if it fails. Personally, I love this, because I'm hard on computers. I move shit around and make it my own. If I do this on a PC, the information becomes so drastically fragmented that the system goes into meltdown mode. On a mac, because of the self-containment of the infrastructure, I can cut, paste, drag, drop, move, shuffle, merge, divide, until my heart's content and it doesn't bog down the efficiency of the system.

 

Coupled with that technology, the Mac has the one and only true definition of Plug and Play. At any given time, I can plug a USB or Firewire device into my mac, and it automatically mounts the device to my desktop, no questions asked. Printer? No problem. Plug it in and hit "print". Digital camera? Opens automatically with iPhoto. Oh hey, how 'bout that iPod? Well, would you like it handled as a music player or as a hard drive? Because the Mac will recognize it and either open iTunes or simply mount it to your desktop for drag-and-drop file transfer goodness.

 

Speaking of Drag-and-Drop, installing most programs is as easy as opening the disc, clicking the app file, and dropping it in your programs folder. For some larger programs like Photoshop, et al, there is an "installation process", but it's a seamless transition that normally takes less than a minute to complete. No muss, no fuss, and best of all? NO RESTARTING.

 

Now, I haven't tried to use made-for-linux programs on the Mac, simply because all the programs I use are made on and for the mac anyway. However I imagine that if they don't directly install, there is a simple emulator that's ready for download or purchase from just about anywhere. Generally speaking, the Mac is good about being accepting of multi-platform file formats. I have a few Adobe products on my Mac, but DJ prefers to use Photoshop on his PC. So for the detailed outlining he does on most of his digital art, he'll start in Illustrator on the Mac, and finish it in Photoshop on the PC. The transfer between the two is seamless, to say the very least.

 

If you haven't figured out already, I love my mac, but I haven't always been a fanatic - in fact as few as three years ago I wanted nothing to do with the apple brand at all. But once I gave it a chance, I was hooked for life.

[daytripper]

I love this, because I'm hard on computers

 

Thank you for your insight!

 

 

And in the games arena?

[Jesi]

Thank you for your insight!

And in the games arena?

 

When you can find games that are compatible for the mac, it's a great experience. However since more people use PCs than Macs, the gaming industry tends to push its software in the PC direction, making the Mac gamers take a back seat. I myself haven't done much gaming on the mac, simply because the games I want to play I already have for the PC, and I can't justify spending the extra money. However, I'm FINALLY upgrading to OSX v.4 (Tiger) so that I can load World of Warcraft and play. I started playing WoW a little on DJ's account and he successfully hooked me, so I'm getting my own account.

 

Generally speaking, gameplay on a mac versus a PC is comparable, depending on the hardware of both. With the mac being created to handle graphics-intensive software (for graphic design and animation) it should be superior to the PC experience. A standard mac can generally handle more workload than a standard PC, but PC hardware is easier to install than in some macs, so a few DIMMs of memory and away you go. Our Gateway PC has upgraded video and memory and so it performs well with games like WoW. My iMac is all stock, so it probably won't handle the same way with WoW. Once I get everything set up I'll report back here and let you know my observations.

[daytripper]

I been inside a mac once. Took off the heat shield(heat baffle), looked at the logic board, and... damn it's not that bad. Althought I didn't see much room for expansion, most macs I seen out there comes with comparable componets off the bat. I guess PC manufacturers are more willing to sell you crap knowing its easy to upgrade.

 

If you look up on Google one can easily see that steps are being taken to distribute titles evenly across the board to all PC Mac Linux and console systems. I especially loved how WoW discs can be installed on either PC or Mac. I hope to see more of this in the future

[daytripper]

Affordable Option

November 2005 By Justine Brown

Indiana finds open source software is key to making one-to-one student/computer initiative a reality.

 

For Mike Huffman, the Indiana Department of Education's special assistant for technology, creating a plan to provide a computer for every student in the state's 385 high schools required a delicate balancing act.

 

"We've had to take into account affordability, flexibility, sustainability and scalability," he said. "Each of those elements has been critical to making this work."

 

This fall, Huffman helped launch the Indiana Affordable Computers for Every Secondary Student (ACCESS) initiative, a partnership involving Novell, Intel, Dell and others. The plan is designed to eventually put a desktop computer in front of every high school student in the state, and the use of open source software plays a key role in making the plan work.

 

more...

 

In order for Linux to emerge as a serious competitor I believe standards need to be set, code needs to be revised, and manuals (not just documentation) need to be written! I think it's time to start emailing Red Hat to start getting some top-of-the-line info! But more and more people are realizing that Linux, no, Open Source, is the cost effective solution to todays budget-concious institutions. But we may be one or two generations away from Linux being a true contestant for our desktop.

 

I think I need to re-evaluate the title of the thread!

 

Please, comment!

[daytripper]

an update to the previous post

$100 laptop for poor children unveiled

 

One Laptop Per Child programme moves off the drawing board

Ken Young, vnunet.com 17 Nov 2005

 

Nicholas Negroponte, founder and chairman of MIT's Media Lab, has shown off his prototype $100 laptop at the Tunis World Summit on the Information Society.

 

The ruggedised laptop, which includes a crank for generating its own power, is being developed under the One Laptop Per Child initiative, which aims to allow children in the Third World to own their own PC.

 

Negroponte said that his non-profit organisation is currently negotiating with manufacturers and will have an initial order placed by February or March.

 

Thailand and Brazil are among the six countries that have showed the strongest interest so far.

 

The final design includes a low-power display designed to run for up to 40 minutes in black-and-white mode with one minute of cranking.

 

The current specs include a 500MHz processor, 1GB of memory and a unique dual-mode display that can be used in full-colour or in a black-and-white sunlight-readable mode.

 

Negroponte confirmed that the laptop will run an open source operating system, probably Linux, rather than a proprietary product from Apple or Microsoft.

 

Companies including Google, AMD, News Corp and Red Hat have so far donated to the project.

 

The laptop currently costs $115 to manufacture but Negroponte hoped that the price would drift closer to the $100 target and even lower as production volumes increase. He said that some governments were not able to pay $100 per machine.

 

Commentators have pointed out that if the laptops are given to children in poor families which may have an income of less than £2,000 a year, there may be a strong temptation to sell the device to help feed or clothe the family.

 

Negropronte maintained that distributing the device through government education departments will help reduce this risk.

From...

 

And more info can be found at http://laptop.media.mit.edu/

[bunnyfoofoo]

i'm actually in the market for a laptop, and it seems that every techie i know and have spoken to, has tried to sell me mac. so i went to the mac store at the falls and spoke to one of their resident geeks... they even had an area in the back to teach us pc-users how to do things the simple way, i.e. the mac way. lol i think i spent the entire telling arch "omg... did you see that?!" and "wait... he just dragged it... and.... and there it is... woah" and lets face it, a mac anything is just as much a fashion accessory as it is practical hardware. lol ;) which is always nice! >)

[daytripper]

Yeah mac is seriously making leap and bound progress in the choice PC/laptop. Rumours from the tech watercooler indicates how a lot of anti-M$ gearheads are pushing Apple to be the desktop of choice, claiming ease of use and intelligent interface far better than anything you can find on Windows.

 

Of course, of my clients that I have built workstations for, all they get is Gentoo with KDE desktop (you have options of what GUI you use). It's free after all :p

[Reverend Jax]

Bill Gates could open source all his products, put Office into a public project and port it to Linux, adopt the GPL and people will continue to regard him with contempt. He may give all his money away before he dies and the world won't even mention him as a footnote in history. The Gates legacy lives in infamy. We know him for what he represents.

 

OK, this guy is living in a Gates-hater bubble. No matter what Gates does from thsi point on, he will be far more than a footnote in history. He could sell leave his position at Microsoft and get a part time job at Sizzler, his place in the history of innovators is as secure at this point as Gutenburg or Archemides, regardless of whether or not you like him. Will Steve Jobs rise and revolutionize the tech world like he did over 2 decades ago? Maybe. I sure hope so. But Gates' legacy will be a great one remembers for centuries, one short-sighters Gates-haters can't understand.

[archangel]

I dunno, I've always felt that the Mac vs PC argument boils down to: Pay Bill Gates a little, or Pay Bill Gates alot....In the end, you still give money to Gates.

[daytripper]

I don't think that was the focus of the article. And there are a lot of people that hate Microsoft. There are also those that hate entities such as Wal-Mart, the AOL, French, and FPL. Besides the article was obviously a editorial full of opinions that I mentioned in my previous post in regards to pushing Apple's OS/X to be more competitive against Microsoft's Windows. The fact that the writer is anti-M$ does not negate current trends of the OS/X push. Besides, saying that Microsoft and Bill Gates K.B.E. had no impact on innovation in the technical industry is absurd. As I previously mentioned, we are at the eve of a major change at the way we interface with our information. And OS/X (the system built on unix and tweeked for desktop use by Apple for thier Machintosh systems) is gaining support from the Linux community, anti-M$ or not.

[archangel]

lol I know, man.

 

i was just being fecitious (and stating an observation while doing so) It really had no bearing at all on the article.

 

I will say that, as a PC user, the new Mac OS really interested me. If it weren't for the fact that I have too much software to convert to switch to Mac, I'd probably do so.

[daytripper]

haha, my last reply was in reference to Mr. Jax :p

 

But I think that what holds a lot of people back from switching, Arch, myself included. The lack of support of the software that we are used to using. And the best response I got from [Linspire (Linux flavor)] tech support was:

 

Discussion Thread

Response (Ernie) 11/09/2005 02:50 PM

Hello ,

 

Thank you for contacting the Linspire Support Team.

 

Please this answer is from our FAQ's:

NOTE: Linspire, Inc. does not provide support for third party software (e.g. - Win4Lin, Crossover Office, WINE, WineX, etc.).

 

There are certain games made for Microsoft Windows that will work with WINE for Linspire installed. However, Linspire does not support DirectX and most new games made for Microsoft Windows now use DirectX -- Microsoft's proprietary system for handling 3D graphics, audio, and keyboard/mouse input.

 

An alternative to running DirectX games in Linux is Cedega (formerly WineX). Cedega is an implementation of Wine that allows you to play DirectX games under Linux. For more information on Cedega, please visit www.transgaming.com or www.transgaming.org.

Games like Unreal Tournament and Quake II (to name a few) have Linux versions and are available in the Warehouse. There are even more exciting games available in the Warehouse -- click here to search for other games. Some of the favorites, among others, are Orbz and Marble Blast.

 

If you need further assistance with general information, please reply to this incident.

 

Best Regards,

 

Ernie

-The Linspire Team

 

I mean seriously, this guy sucks ass. This totally makes me not want to come within 6 feet of that OS. But there is a software program that called Virtual PC and VM Ware that lets you set up a virtual system with-in your own. But that's a helluva lot more trouble. And then they (Apple, Sun Microsystems, among many other UNIX/Linux variants) claim they have cpmparable software, but it just isn't the same as having what you are used to. Get the publisher's support, then people won't be so terrified to take that leap.

[archangel]

yea, that virtual OS crap is horrible. I remember messing with that a few years back (Like 7) and wanting to kill someone. Wanna see a Mac freeze? do that lol

 

Also, yea, it's guys like that that make me turn back to a PC. I've invested way too much money (in some cases) and time and effort (in other cases) looking for software, either bought or....found.

 

So my option then becomes: buy the Mac version. Sure buddy. You give the money to buy ALL of my software over again.

 

Dickhead lol

[daytripper]

I', hoping that the next couple of months provides the public with better standards and publishers that would produce software for more platforms.

[bishopcruz]

In case you all didn't know:

 

From apple's website:

 

Apple to Use Intel Microprocessors Beginning in 2006

 

WWDC 2005, SAN FRANCISCO—June 6, 2005—At its Worldwide Developer Conference today, Apple® announced plans to deliver models of its Macintosh® computers using Intel® microprocessors by this time next year, and to transition all of its Macs to using Intel microprocessors by the end of 2007. Apple previewed a version of its critically acclaimed operating system, Mac OS® X Tiger, running on an Intel-based Mac® to the over 3,800 developers attending CEO Steve Jobs’ keynote address. Apple also announced the availability of a Developer Transition Kit, consisting of an Intel-based Mac development system along with preview versions of Apple’s software, which will allow developers to prepare versions of their applications which will run on both PowerPC and Intel-based Macs.

 

“Our goal is to provide our customers with the best personal computers in the world, and looking ahead Intel has the strongest processor roadmap by far,” said Steve Jobs, Apple’s CEO. “It’s been ten years since our transition to the PowerPC, and we think Intel’s technology will help us create the best personal computers for the next ten years.”

 

“We are thrilled to have the world’s most innovative personal computer company as a customer,” said Paul Otellini, president and CEO of Intel. “Apple helped found the PC industry and throughout the years has been known for fresh ideas and new approaches. We look forward to providing advanced chip technologies, and to collaborating on new initiatives, to help Apple continue to deliver innovative products for years to come.”

 

“We plan to create future versions of Microsoft Office for the Mac that support both PowerPC and Intel processors,” said Roz Ho, general manager of Microsoft’s Macintosh Business Unit. “We have a strong relationship with Apple and will work closely with them to continue our long tradition of making great applications for a great platform.”

 

“We think this is a really smart move on Apple’s part and plan to create future versions of our Creative Suite for Macintosh that support both PowerPC and Intel processors,” said Bruce Chizen, CEO of Adobe.

 

The Developer Transition Kit is available starting today for $999 to all Apple Developer Connection Select and Premier members. Further information for Apple Developer Connection members is available at developer.apple.com. Intel plans to provide industry leading development tools support for Apple later this year, including the Intel C/C++ Compiler for Apple, Intel Fortran Compiler for Apple, Intel Math Kernel Libraries for Apple and Intel Integrated Performance Primitives for Apple.

 

Intel (www.intel.com), the world’s largest chip maker, is also a leading manufacturer of computer, networking and communications products.

 

Apple ignited the personal computer revolution in the 1970s with the Apple II and reinvented the personal computer in the 1980s with the Macintosh. Today, Apple continues to lead the industry in innovation with its award-winning desktop and notebook computers, OS X operating system, and iLife and professional applications. Apple is also spearheading the digital music revolution with its iPod portable music players and iTunes online music store.

 

Which is an interesting move, at that point the only real difference between an Mac and a PC will be the software, the problem I see on the horizon is that you're gonna need new software to run on a new processor. Having to develop 2 different sets of code for two different CPU families could be a major pain in the ass.

 

I know a lot of Mac heads are not happy about this turn around. So if you are thinking of getting a Mac I would wait until next year at least.

 

Though personally, PCs and M$ for ever. XP is a great OS, and Vista looks like its gonna be sweet.

[daytripper]

heh, vista. Have you read up on the latest news? Problems with Vista and Singularity have the boys in Redmond nervouse ^^