Metal as a genre

[DKS01]

Megadeth never was, nor ever will be metal. They lack the soul to be a metal band. It's heartless, commercial bullshit. If you can't see this then there is no help for you. I don't give two shits what popular opinion has decided, or what the consensus of all the people on every message board ever have come to. Megadeth isn't metal. If that is what metal ever was then I guess I never listened to metal....thankfully so. I bet you like Dream Theater and Trivium too.On a side note, thanks for the info about HTML.

 

Are you smoking crack right now, or did you just finish smoking it? There was nothing REMOTELY commercial about Peace Sells, Killing is My Business, or Rust in Peace, that kinda music simply WAS NOT what was big when those albums came out. Hell, the music they're playing NOW(which is a lot less aggressive than back in the day) isn't commercial, if they were going for a commercial sound NOW they'd be doing stuff like Killswitch Engage or Disturbed. You clearly are fucking clueless about the band, yet for some reason you continue to talk about them. Saddening, but not entirely uncommon.

 

As for Trivium, the first 2 albums don't interst me, the second 2 are tolerable if for some reason I wanna hear old Metallica without actually listening to old Metallica. And Dream Theater bores me to tears with the vast majority of their music, so no, I'm not really a fan of either band. Now, relevance of your question?

[Mortiis558]

Are you smoking crack right now, or did you just finish smoking it? There was nothing REMOTELY commercial about Peace Sells, Killing is My Business, or Rust in Peace, that kinda music simply WAS NOT what was big when those albums came out. Hell, the music they're playing NOW(which is a lot less aggressive than back in the day) isn't commercial, if they were going for a commercial sound NOW they'd be doing stuff like Killswitch Engage or Disturbed. You clearly are fucking clueless about the band, yet for some reason you continue to talk about them. Saddening, but not entirely uncommon.

 

As for Trivium, the first 2 albums don't interst me, the second 2 are tolerable if for some reason I wanna hear old Metallica without actually listening to old Metallica. And Dream Theater bores me to tears with the vast majority of their music, so no, I'm not really a fan of either band. Now, relevance of your question?

 

They're more commercial than 99% of the bands I listen to. But that really isn't the point. To me they sound like processed, generic, commercial crap. I don't really care what you say they will never be considered metal in my book. I've heard them on the radio for almost 2 decades, not once has it ever crossed my mind that they would even remotely be similar to anything I called metal. To me they always sounded like bad shit from the 80's. When Rust in Peace came out I was listening to shit like Carcass, Bathory, Morbid Angel, so maybe you understand what kinda crack I must be smoking to think Megadeth isn't metal. Mustaine's voice kills it. And not just because he doesn't sit there and do cookie monster growls for 4 minutes. Hell if he did I would probably give them more credit. If he even did the generic thrash voice I could stand to call it metal but as is they aren't.

 

Relevance...I wanted to see if you were just stupid or legally retarded. Be glad to know you're only the former.

 

And dont pick on Logan ASC, maybe if I had let him listen to Megadeth instead of Samael he might be a metalhead by now.

Edited February 17, 2009 by Mortiis558

[The NZA]

most genres have some distinguishing features that make their criteria. take blues, some might point to content, but a lot of its in the tetrameter, and some of the instruments as well.

granted, later genres such as techno/trance/drum & bass etc clearly have sub-genres where the lines blur for me, but you know, there's still usually lines.

 

that said, what specifically constitutes metal? what's missing from Megadeath that make them a metal band? lack of a harpsicord? it cant have anything to do with commercial success, cause Metallica (pre-load) as i understand it still counts.

[DKS01]

They're more commercial than 99% of the bands I listen to. But that really isn't the point. To me they sound like processed, generic, commercial crap. I don't really care what you say they will never be considered metal in my book. I've heard them on the radio for almost 2 decades, not once has it ever crossed my mind that they would even remotely be similar to anything I called metal. To me they always sounded like bad shit from the 80's. When Rust in Peace came out I was listening to shit like Carcass, Bathory, Morbid Angel, so maybe you understand what kinda crack I must be smoking to think Megadeth isn't metal. Mustaine's voice kills it. And not just because he doesn't sit there and do cookie monster growls for 4 minutes. Hell if he did I would probably give them more credit. If he even did the generic thrash voice I could stand to call it metal but as is they aren't.

 

Relevance...I wanted to see if you were just stupid or legally retarded. Be glad to know you're only the former.

 

And dont pick on Logan ASC, maybe if I had let him listen to Megadeth instead of Samael he might be a metalhead by now.

 

Commercialism isn't the point, yet you made a point of bringing it up. Telling, but oh well. So does any band who's put out "commercial" or successful music no longer count as metal? Megadeth on the radio for 2 decades, riiiiight. Kinda curious what stations you were listening to for those 2 decades. Those bands you listed, I dare say THEY would laugh their ass off at you claiming Megadeth isn't metal....I KNOW Carcass would.

 

And next question, how does having crap vocals prevent them from being metal? Yes, Dave's vocals suck, I agree. But that's 100%, completely, totally, absolutely irrelevant to them being metal. Metal vocals cover the spectrum from the ultra high pitched annoying singers in power metal bands like Labyrinth and Angra, to mid range melodic voices like the singers of Circle II Circle and Axel Rudi Pell, to gruff yet understandable vocals like the singers for Grave Digger and Sabaton, down to the ultra deep bellows of Nile and Morbid Angel, even to opera style vocals like Nightwish and Operatica. And yes, it also includes Dave's constipated sounding singing. Sure, I too would prefer the "generic thrash voice", but they're still just as metal as ANY band you've mentioned thus far(and yes, I own albums by all of them as well, just in case you think I've only heard a song or 2 by them), and frankly, as far as taste goes, I'd take RIP over anything ANY of those bands have put out to date.

 

As for sounding like "bad shit from the 80's", cite me some examples of non THRASH METAL bands that sound remotely like RIP or Peace Sells?

[Thelogan]

And dont pick on Logan ASC

 

Oh, it's quite alright. I've got my big-boy pants on and I almost literally asked for it.

 

It's all for shiggles.

 

As you were.

[alive she cried]

And dont pick on Logan ASC, maybe if I had let him listen to Megadeth instead of Samael he might be a metalhead by now.

 

I picked on Logan?

 

I was just getting that turkey to quite sassin' me.

A turkey is a bad person

[Signal08]

and here, I thought turkey was a big bird that got picked on once a year.

[alive she cried]

I picked on Logan?

 

I was just getting that turkey to quite sassin' me.

A turkey is a bad person

 

Should've been jivin' not sassin'

[Signal08]

the only day its bad to be a jive mother fuckin' turkey, is thanksgivin' day!

 

 

I'll get my coat!

[Mortiis558]

Commercialism isn't the point, yet you made a point of bringing it up. Telling, but oh well. So does any band who's put out "commercial" or successful music no longer count as metal? Megadeth on the radio for 2 decades, riiiiight. Kinda curious what stations you were listening to for those 2 decades. Those bands you listed, I dare say THEY would laugh their ass off at you claiming Megadeth isn't metal....I KNOW Carcass would.

 

And next question, how does having crap vocals prevent them from being metal? Yes, Dave's vocals suck, I agree. But that's 100%, completely, totally, absolutely irrelevant to them being metal. Metal vocals cover the spectrum from the ultra high pitched annoying singers in power metal bands like Labyrinth and Angra, to mid range melodic voices like the singers of Circle II Circle and Axel Rudi Pell, to gruff yet understandable vocals like the singers for Grave Digger and Sabaton, down to the ultra deep bellows of Nile and Morbid Angel, even to opera style vocals like Nightwish and Operatica. And yes, it also includes Dave's constipated sounding singing. Sure, I too would prefer the "generic thrash voice", but they're still just as metal as ANY band you've mentioned thus far(and yes, I own albums by all of them as well, just in case you think I've only heard a song or 2 by them), and frankly, as far as taste goes, I'd take RIP over anything ANY of those bands have put out to date.

 

As for sounding like "bad shit from the 80's", cite me some examples of non THRASH METAL bands that sound remotely like RIP or Peace Sells?

 

I concede without Dave they are metal. At least some earlier shit I've listened to (again recently). But for me Dave ruins that. He is what makes me think of them as merely hard rock. To me there is no feeling behind the vocals. He is trying to be something he isn't and it shows. True metal strikes me deep within my soul. It resonates with me and I can feel something I can't really put into words. It is moving to me, much in the same way people are moved by a movie or a story, or whatever people are affected by. Megadeth has never elicited these feelings so I don't consider them metal. Dave's singing is so offsetting it ruins anything the rest of the band is trying to do. At least with a band like Circle II Circle you can sense feeling behind him singing. Dave lacks the essence of being metal and degrades his band because of it in my eyes.

 

As for citing some bands, I don't know any. I never sat down and listened all the way through to RIP, or Peace Sells or shitty 80's rock bands. But every city I've ever lived in (Austin, San Antonio, Dallas) have had their Saturday night metal shows and they've all played Megadeth at some point in time or another. It never struck me as metal back then and I often wondered why they played it. I just figured it was a way to get people in to listen to the real stuff. Even if Megadeth did 300bpm Blast Beats with guitars tuned down 2.5 steps and sang about being satan's instruments of unholy destruction, as long as Dave still sang the way he does now, they still wouldn't be metal.

[DKS01]

I concede without Dave they are metal. At least some earlier shit I've listened to (again recently). But for me Dave ruins that. He is what makes me think of them as merely hard rock. To me there is no feeling behind the vocals.

 

So then Megadeth is metal with a singer who has no feeling behind the vocals. As I said before, vocal style is 100% irrelevant to rather a band is metal or not, nor is "feeling" required. There are bands in EVERY genre of music ever created who don't seem to have much feeling, that doesn't change the fact that they're still part of their particular genre.

 

And frankly, I find more "feeling" in Dave's vocals than I do in 90% of death and black metal, so eh and for that matter, more feeling than in a lot of power metal as well. Hell, I find more feeling in Megadeth's vocals than I do in Morbid Angel's, so is Morbid Angel not metal? I mean, obviously they don't go around sounding like that normally, so I guess they must be trying to be something they aren't as well, so by your own rationale, Morbid Angel isn't metal.

 

And last of all, you heard Megadeth on the late night METAL SHOWS, not commercial radio, which also sorta negates that point you were making about them "commercial" too, does it not?

Edited February 18, 2009 by DKS01

[Mortiis558]

So then Megadeth is metal with a singer who has no feeling behind the vocals. As I said before, vocal style is 100% irrelevant to rather a band is metal or not, nor is "feeling" required. There are bands in EVERY genre of music ever created who don't seem to have much feeling, that doesn't change the fact that they're still part of their particular genre.

 

And frankly, I find more "feeling" in Dave's vocals than I do in 90% of death and black metal, so eh and for that matter, more feeling than in a lot of power metal as well. Hell, I find more feeling in Megadeth's vocals than I do in Morbid Angel's, so is Morbid Angel not metal? I mean, obviously they don't go around sounding like that normally, so I guess they must be trying to be something they aren't as well, so by your own rationale, Morbid Angel isn't metal.

 

And last of all, you heard Megadeth on the late night METAL SHOWS, not commercial radio, which also sorta negates that point you were making about them "commercial" too, does it not?

 

I tried to explain why Dave's vocals make Megadeth not a metal band to me. There is not much more I can say. If, as you say, Megadeth are a metal band, then they are one of the shittiest examples of metal I have ever heard. I'll stick to my own shitty metal and be content knowing Megadeth will never curse my hard drive with their filth.

 

And if you don't want to call Morbid Angel metal cause you don't find as much feeling with David's vocals that is your prerogative. But you and I both know you could never justifiedly call them not metal without just being spiteful. I wasn't just talking about vocals though. You can reread my other posts if you want clarification on that.

 

I guess you musta just missed all their play time on commercial radio and television. Being the metal god you are I am suprised this slipped your notice. Maybe I am right since you are so oblivious to the genre to not have known this. See Megadeth has sold millions of albums to people who think they are metal. They have blinded you like they have blinded many others. But go on and continue to try and justify them as metal. Since I know the real shit when I hear it I'll continue to laugh at your absurdity and back bands that truly deserve the title, not some half-assed wanna be crap.

[DKS01]

I tried to explain why Dave's vocals make Megadeth not a metal band to me. There is not much more I can say. If, as you say, Megadeth are a metal band, then they are one of the shittiest examples of metal I have ever heard. I'll stick to my own shitty metal and be content knowing Megadeth will never curse my hard drive with their filth.

 

And if you don't want to call Morbid Angel metal cause you don't find as much feeling with David's vocals that is your prerogative. But you and I both know you could never justifiedly call them not metal without just being spiteful. I wasn't just talking about vocals though. You can reread my other posts if you want clarification on that.

 

I guess you musta just missed all their play time on commercial radio and television. Being the metal god you are I am suprised this slipped your notice. Maybe I am right since you are so oblivious to the genre to not have known this. See Megadeth has sold millions of albums to people who think they are metal. They have blinded you like they have blinded many others. But go on and continue to try and justify them as metal. Since I know the real shit when I hear it I'll continue to laugh at your absurdity and back bands that truly deserve the title, not some half-assed wanna be crap.

 

I call Morbid Angel metal, but using your faulty logic, I can EASILY justify calling them not metal. I'm not a moron however, and I know how utterly flawed your "logic" is, so I won't do that. But truely, using your justifactions for why Megadeth isn't metal, the very same things apply to MA, so, by YOUR ARGUMENT, Morbid Angel apparently isn't metal.

 

Yes, eventually Megadeth became successful, at the time, they were not commercial. Same with Black Sabbath, Jethro Tull, Judas Priest, Metallica, and dozens of other bands from dozens of other genres. Just because they eventually became sucessful AFTER THE FACT doesn't mean they were commerical when those albums were released. Megadeth didn't start getting regular airplay on commercial radio until Youthanasia, just like Metallica did with their s/t following some exposure for One from AJFA. Learn your history and get back to me. The word for people who call Megadeth metal isn't "blind", it's "accurate", you should look into it sometime.

[Mortiis558]

I call Morbid Angel metal, but using your faulty logic, I can EASILY justify calling them not metal. I'm not a moron however, and I know how utterly flawed your "logic" is, so I won't do that. But truely, using your justifactions for why Megadeth isn't metal, the very same things apply to MA, so, by YOUR ARGUMENT, Morbid Angel apparently isn't metal.

 

Yes, eventually Megadeth became successful, at the time, they were not commercial. Same with Black Sabbath, Jethro Tull, Judas Priest, Metallica, and dozens of other bands from dozens of other genres. Just because they eventually became sucessful AFTER THE FACT doesn't mean they were commerical when those albums were released. Megadeth didn't start getting regular airplay on commercial radio until Youthanasia, just like Metallica did with their s/t following some exposure for One from AJFA. Learn your history and get back to me. The word for people who call Megadeth metal isn't "blind", it's "accurate", you should look into it sometime.

 

The very same things apply to Morbid Angel for YOU. So by my logic, to YOU, Morbid Angel isn't metal. Thank you for trying to understand but I can see you still fail to grasp what I am trying to say. If I indeed thought that Dave's vocals had more feeling than David's vocals, by all means you could conclude that I don't think Morbid Angel is metal. I never once said this, so quit assuming you know everything.

 

So I heard them before they went commercial and they didn't sound like metal to me, I heard them after they became popular and they still didn't sound like metal to me. What don't you understand? I don't think Megadeth is metal. Nothing you can say will ever change that.

 

I am glad you like my logic enough to declare Morbid Angel isn't metal while Megadeth is. It's a shame though, because I don't agree at all and to see my own logic twisted in such a way is a disgrace to my intelligence. You may think you know what other people think about metal but it seems you have no clear cut idea of what metal is to YOU. You can't even explain how Megadeth is metal. You coulda bullshitted your way through and said the lyrics or the style they had back in the day, or even maybe mentioned something about how musically they are metal instead of just saying...They play fucking metal, duh! Brilliant, eloquent, subtle even. You can't justify a simple question, meanwhile I've done nothing but try to explain how they aren't. So learn how to debate, get some different arguements, learn proper reading comprehension and stop trying to argue something you, yourself have no clue about. You think they're metal therefore they are? When has that ever fuckin flown anywhere but inside your own inflated head?

 

On a fucked up side note, that completely justifies everything I have ever thought, Dave Mustaine is playing himself on an episode of the cartoon Duck Dodgers that is playing at my house right now. This is what you are protecting! Let's see Ishan or Corpsegrinder on a kid's show. You fail horribly...it's not just him either it's the whole band.

 

Mort - 1 DKS - 0 Let's do another band, this is fun. You mentioned you liked Savatage was it?

[DKS01]

"The very same things apply to Morbid Angel for YOU. So by my logic, to YOU, Morbid Angel isn't metal. Thank you for trying to understand but I can see you still fail to grasp what I am trying to say. If I indeed thought that Dave's vocals had more feeling than David's vocals, by all means you could conclude that I don't think Morbid Angel is metal. I never once said this, so quit assuming you know everything. "

 

And if I said MA wasn't metal you'd say I was full of shit, and rightfully so.

 

"So I heard them before they went commercial and they didn't sound like metal to me, I heard them after they became popular and they still didn't sound like metal to me. What don't you understand? I don't think Megadeth is metal. Nothing you can say will ever change that. "

 

If they don't sound like metal, what do they sound like? Name a "hard rock" band that sounds like Rust in Peace, or Killing Is My Business, or fuck, even name a hard rock band that sounds like United Abominations. They're not rap, they're not country, they're not techno, so tell me, name a genre they fit in OTHER than metal? Fuck it, you can't, you already ADMITTED they play metal and they only reason you're claiming they aren't is because Dave's singing sucks and cause he doesn't have some sorta "feeling" in his vocals.

 

" It's a shame though, because I don't agree at all and to see my own logic twisted in such a way is a disgrace to my intelligence."

 

Making the claim to begin with was a disgrace to your intelligence.

 

"You can't even explain how Megadeth is metal. "

 

Umm, cause of the riffs, the solos, the drumming, and umm, well, EVERY FUCKING THING ABOUT THEM? There's nothing about them that ISN'T metal, musically speaking.

 

" about how musically they are metal instead of just saying..."

 

Anyone with an IQ in the double digits didn't need it explained. I'm sorry you did.

 

"You can't justify a simple question, meanwhile I've done nothing but try to explain how they aren't. "

 

An argument that holds no water now, and held none when you first made it.

 

"On a fucked up side note, that completely justifies everything I have ever thought, Dave Mustaine is playing himself on an episode of the cartoon Duck Dodgers that is playing at my house right now. This is what you are protecting! Let's see Ishan or Corpsegrinder on a kid's show. You fail horribly...it's not just him either it's the whole band. "

 

They already dress like clowns, so it's not that far fetched, assuming any kid's show would actually want em. But regardless, what does Dave being on a cartoon that have to do with what they were doing in 1986? You STILL can't seem to grasp the fairly simple concept that just because a band succeeds eventually doesn't mean all the stuff they did up TO that point was "commercial", and that's a point you've dodged AGAIN AND AGAIN. When Black Sabbath put out their s/t album, they sounded NOTHING like what the popular bands at the time were doing. Just because that album has since sold more than a million copies, and Sabbath has since become a household name complete with Ozzy on his own goofy reality show, DOESN'T MEAN BLACK SABBATH WAS A COMMERCIAL ALBUM.

 

"Mort - 1 DKS - 0 "

 

Good to see your scoring is as flawed as your logic.

[Mortiis558]

I am through discussing this with you. Megadeth no longer have any right to be called metal. I'll say the same for Cannibal Corpse if they ever appear on Dora the Explorer.

 

 

Did you get the hidden message??

[DKS01]

I am through discussing this with you. Megadeth no longer have any right to be called metal. I'll say the same for Cannibal Corpse if they ever appear on Dora the Explorer.

 

Did you get the hidden message??

 

I got 2 messages out of it. One-Death metal still sucks. Two-I'll continue to dodge the points you've made time and again because I still can't come up with a logical response to them.

 

So which one were you talking about?

[Mortiis558]

I got 2 messages out of it. One-Death metal still sucks. Two-I'll continue to dodge the points you've made time and again because I still can't come up with a logical response to them.

 

So which one were you talking about?

 

Both actually! You're just soo smart.

[Mortiis558]

Death Metal still sucks? You use a song put out in the late 90's to confirm this?

 

As for my alleged point dodging...If you read what I posted and actually understood it you would see this isn't true. I explained how I thought they sounded commercial, I explained why I thought they weren't metal, I explained what defines metal for me. Just because you have prescribed to and live by the opinions of others doesn't mean they are true. You proliferate a belief I think is false. You just think you are justified because there are other people who agree with you. But I don't think you know your shit. I think you have just stolen your own opinion from others who have taken the time to listen and figure out what defines the genre for them.

 

So exactly what metal do you like? Name some bands, because knowing you I would get a response like "I like all metal that's good idiot." You ran a show? What bands did you play? What bands did you choose to promote?

[DKS01]

Death Metal still sucks? You use a song put out in the late 90's to confirm this?

 

As for my alleged point dodging...If you read what I posted and actually understood it you would see this isn't true. I explained how I thought they sounded commercial, I explained why I thought they weren't metal, I explained what defines metal for me. Just because you have prescribed to and live by the opinions of others doesn't mean they are true. You proliferate a belief I think is false. You just think you are justified because there are other people who agree with you. But I don't think you know your shit. I think you have just stolen your own opinion from others who have taken the time to listen and figure out what defines the genre for them.

 

So exactly what metal do you like? Name some bands, because knowing you I would get a response like "I like all metal that's good idiot." You ran a show? What bands did you play? What bands did you choose to promote?

 

You're STILL dodging several points I've made, so feel free to try again. You kept rambling about how Megadeth is commercial, yet could never explain how so, you cite strange examples such as Dave being on some cartoon(which came out LONG after their classic albums), you cite them being played on METAL radio shows and ignore the fact that mainstream radio didn't pick them up until Youthanasia, and so on. You cited them as sounding like "hard rock", yet could not name a single hard rock band they supposedly sounded like.

 

As for my opinion, I formed my opinion by LISTENING to them, and everyone else that listened to them formed the same opinion, because, without being STUPID, there's no other opinion to FORM about them. The riffs are clearly as metal as anything out at that time period, if not moreso, the guitar techniques, the soloing style, the drumming, it's NOT shit they do in "hard rock" bands, it IS shit that do in METAL bands, and THAT my friend, is what makes them metal.

 

What bands do I like and what bands did I promote? I like and have promoted hundreds of bands. Blind Guardian, Savatage and all their related projects(Dr. Butcher, Circle II Circle, TSO, Jon Oliva's Pain), Judas Priest and Halford's solo discs(as Halford, not as Fight or as Two), Iron Maiden and Bruce Dickinson's later solo stuff(Accident of Birth and beyond), Exodus, Testament, old Metallica, Sabbat, Heathen, Skyclad, Grave Digger, Brainstorm, Running Wild, X-Wild, King Diamond/Mercyful Fate, Amon Amarth, Dissection, Emperor, Rage(not Rage Against the Machine), Candlemass, Doomsword, Dio, Solitude Aeturnus, Manilla Road, Crimson Glory, Queensryche, Helloween, Gamma Ray, Kreator, Destruction, Annihilator, Toxik, Mirage, Paradox, Persuader, Alestorm, Ensiferum, Falconer, Mithotyn, Wuthering Heights, Korpiklaani, Falchion, post-Andre Matos Angra, Aria, Kipelov, Scar Symmetry, Human Fortress, Megadeth, Overkill, Gardenian, Intense, Firewind, Death Angel, Artillery, Forbidden, Xentrix, Into Eternity, Unleashed, Volbeat, Cirith Ungol, Psychotic Waltz, Nevermore, Communic, Scariot, Evergrey, Dark Empire, Criminal Sanity, Shadow Gallery, Metal Church, Riot, Saxon, Nightwish, Die Apokalyptischen Reiter, old In Flames, Sear Bliss, Immortal, Therion, Pharaoh, Elvenking, Tyr, Symphony X, Ayreon/Star One, Viking, Seventh Angel, Coroner, Iced Earth, Winterfell, Anacrusis, Waylander, Devastation, Holocaust, Stormwitch, some Manowar, Motorhead, Pathosray, Tarot, Mekong Delta, Betrayer, Holy Moses, Borknagar, Eluviete, Jag Panzer, Liege Lord, Tierra Santa, Master, Mercenary, SOAD(yes, I like some "nu-metal"), Death, Sanctuary, VII Gates, Clenched Fist, Accept/UDO, Saint Daemon, Nocturnal Rites, Defender, Axel Rudi Pell, Evildead, Abattoir, WASP(mainly Headless Children/Crimson Idol), Iron Angel, Exciter, Absu, Warlock/Doro, Benedictum, At the Gates, Black Sabbath, Ozzy, Callenish Circle, Brimstone, Soilwork, older CoB, Edguy, Avantasia, Aina, Threshold, Helstar, Destiny's End, Holy Terror, Obituary, Intruder, Kamelot, Morgana Lefay/Lefay, Warlord, Hammerfall, Sabaton, Paragon, Memento Mori, Dark Angel, Mork Gryning, Naglfar, Omen, Rob Rock, Impelliteri, Sacred Reich, Q5, Satan, Jaguar, Tad Morose, Saviour Machine, Vicious Rumors...want more, or is this enough?

[the division of joy]

I fail to see how megadeth have been proven to not be metal.

 

Sticking feathers up your arse does not make you a chicken.

[Thelogan]

Some people say cucumbers taste better pickled.

[the division of joy]

Some people say cucumbers taste better pickled.

They do!

[Mortiis558]

You're STILL dodging several points I've made, so feel free to try again. You kept rambling about how Megadeth is commercial, yet could never explain how so, you cite strange examples such as Dave being on some cartoon(which came out LONG after their classic albums), you cite them being played on METAL radio shows and ignore the fact that mainstream radio didn't pick them up until Youthanasia, and so on. You cited them as sounding like "hard rock", yet could not name a single hard rock band they supposedly sounded like.

 

As for my opinion, I formed my opinion by LISTENING to them, and everyone else that listened to them formed the same opinion, because, without being STUPID, there's no other opinion to FORM about them. The riffs are clearly as metal as anything out at that time period, if not moreso, the guitar techniques, the soloing style, the drumming, it's NOT shit they do in "hard rock" bands, it IS shit that do in METAL bands, and THAT my friend, is what makes them metal.

 

What bands do I like and what bands did I promote? I like and have promoted hundreds of bands. Blind Guardian, Savatage and all their related projects(Dr. Butcher, Circle II Circle, TSO, Jon Oliva's Pain), Judas Priest and Halford's solo discs(as Halford, not as Fight or as Two), Iron Maiden and Bruce Dickinson's later solo stuff(Accident of Birth and beyond), Exodus, Testament, old Metallica, Sabbat, Heathen, Skyclad, Grave Digger, Brainstorm, Running Wild, X-Wild, King Diamond/Mercyful Fate, Amon Amarth, Dissection, Emperor, Rage(not Rage Against the Machine), Candlemass, Doomsword, Dio, Solitude Aeturnus, Manilla Road, Crimson Glory, Queensryche, Helloween, Gamma Ray, Kreator, Destruction, Annihilator, Toxik, Mirage, Paradox, Persuader, Alestorm, Ensiferum, Falconer, Mithotyn, Wuthering Heights, Korpiklaani, Falchion, post-Andre Matos Angra, Aria, Kipelov, Scar Symmetry, Human Fortress, Megadeth, Overkill, Gardenian, Intense, Firewind, Death Angel, Artillery, Forbidden, Xentrix, Into Eternity, Unleashed, Volbeat, Cirith Ungol, Psychotic Waltz, Nevermore, Communic, Scariot, Evergrey, Dark Empire, Criminal Sanity, Shadow Gallery, Metal Church, Riot, Saxon, Nightwish, Die Apokalyptischen Reiter, old In Flames, Sear Bliss, Immortal, Therion, Pharaoh, Elvenking, Tyr, Symphony X, Ayreon/Star One, Viking, Seventh Angel, Coroner, Iced Earth, Winterfell, Anacrusis, Waylander, Devastation, Holocaust, Stormwitch, some Manowar, Motorhead, Pathosray, Tarot, Mekong Delta, Betrayer, Holy Moses, Borknagar, Eluviete, Jag Panzer, Liege Lord, Tierra Santa, Master, Mercenary, SOAD(yes, I like some "nu-metal"), Death, Sanctuary, VII Gates, Clenched Fist, Accept/UDO, Saint Daemon, Nocturnal Rites, Defender, Axel Rudi Pell, Evildead, Abattoir, WASP(mainly Headless Children/Crimson Idol), Iron Angel, Exciter, Absu, Warlock/Doro, Benedictum, At the Gates, Black Sabbath, Ozzy, Callenish Circle, Brimstone, Soilwork, older CoB, Edguy, Avantasia, Aina, Threshold, Helstar, Destiny's End, Holy Terror, Obituary, Intruder, Kamelot, Morgana Lefay/Lefay, Warlord, Hammerfall, Sabaton, Paragon, Memento Mori, Dark Angel, Mork Gryning, Naglfar, Omen, Rob Rock, Impelliteri, Sacred Reich, Q5, Satan, Jaguar, Tad Morose, Saviour Machine, Vicious Rumors...want more, or is this enough?

 

I said they SOUNDED like soulless commercial bullshit. I even explained why I thought this to be so. I've also explained I can't name any bands that are hard rock or 80's shit that sound like them because I don't like Megadeth or anything that would sound remotely similar. Sorry I am not willing to torture myself by reliving the 80's to prove a point.

 

As for everyone else forming the same opinion as you, that is false. I've discussed this very point with a lot of people I have met throughout the years, and some of them would agree with you. Some would also agree with me and many more have a lot more colorful words for Megadeth. But I am sure everyone who disagree's with you about any point having to deal with "metal" is just a stupid retard who doesn't know metal from their own asshole. That's why you like bands like Riot and Queensryche and I like bands like Troll and Myrkskog.

 

Your list contains some true gems (Therion, Eluvitie, At the Gates, Dissection, Emperor, etc) but you also have a predominate "old-school" theme going there. I won't say bands like Kreator or Overkill or Death Angel, aren't metal I just never liked that stuff. I also can't stand metal singers who do vibratto in their singing, I'll stick with the monotonous banshee whails, or gutteral growls. I still don't think Megadeth are metal but I now understand why you think so. But could you name some more bands? Maybe bands I might like? It's hard to take you seriously when your list is pretty much a who's who of bands (though metal) I have never liked.

[DKS01]

" I can't name any bands that are hard rock or 80's shit that sound like them because I don't like Megadeth or anything that would sound remotely similar. Sorry I am not willing to torture myself by reliving the 80's to prove a point."

 

In other words, you're saying they sound like something that you're not actually familiar with, which should sorta preclude you from being able to talk on the subject.

 

"Some would also agree with me"

 

Point me to some of them. I can point you to whole forums of people who will agree with me, show me some who agree with you.

 

"and many more have a lot more colorful words for Megadeth."

 

I can find a lot of people who have colorful words for Megadeth too, but they still don't dispute the fact that they are metal.

 

"Your list contains some true gems (Therion, Eluvitie, At the Gates, Dissection, Emperor, etc) but you also have a predominate "old-school" theme going there."

 

Yes, I prefer good music. And that rules out the majority of death and black metal music, which for the most part, is garbage. Even the bands you list as "true gems" there, other than Dissection, are WAY near the bottom tier of my list in terms of quality.

 

"I won't say bands like Kreator or Overkill or Death Angel, aren't metal I just never liked that stuff. "

 

If those bands are metal, then Megadeth certainly is as well, cause bands like Overkill and Death Angel are the bands Megadeth SOUNDS the most like, not "80's hard rock bands".

 

"But could you name some more bands? Maybe bands I might like? It's hard to take you seriously when your list is pretty much a who's who of bands (though metal) I have never liked."

 

From the death/black metal side of things I don't listen to much, cause frankly, most of it sucks. I've listened to tons of them, hated the music, and as such will never promote it or continue to listen to it. From the growly side of things, I actually listen to and have promoted(I know there's some duplication here, I just don't wanna reread my list and see if I included all these or not)-Dissection, Naglfar, Emperor, At the Gates, Deceased, In Flames(older stuff), Covenant(early), Children of Bodom(older stuff), Brimstone, Amon Amarth, Mork Gryning, Arch Enemy, Carcass, Mortification, Immortal, Sear Bliss, Gardenian, Scar Symmetry, Unleashed, Waylander, Atroocity, Amorbital, Mithotyn, Ensiferum, Eluviete, Bathory, Einherjer, Bolt Thrower, Shadow's Fall, Mercenary, Finntroll, Morbid Angel, Callenish Circle, Absu, Death, Hypocrisy, Ancient Rites, Cynic, Atheist, Dark Tranquility, Benediction, Invocator, Melechesh, Thyrfing...I dunno, there may be more, but as I said, I consider the vast majority of death and black metal to be utter garbage(though still metal) so I don't listen to it.